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80Gb PS3 gets UK release date – according to GAME

Sunday, 10th August 2008 10:21 GMT By Mike

According to UK retail site, GAME, the 80 Gb PS3 will go on sale on August 29.

However, the site does give us a little reminder that the 80 gig version does not include the following:

  • Backwards Compatibility with PS2 Games
  • Memory Stick Card Readers
  • SACD Playback
  • Ethernet Cable
  • 4 USB Ports, (The PS3 80GB model features 2)

Still interested?

By Mike Bowden

Breaking news

68 Comments

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  1. Syrok

    So it does include the DS3.

    Why did they leave the ethernet cable out and who has SACDs anyway?

    #1 6 years ago
  2. Panipal2005

    Still glad I imported a 60Gb model from Canada. You know, the ones Sony made their biggest PS3 losses on. EU doesn’t deserve BC? Fuck you right back, Sony.

    #2 6 years ago
  3. Robo_1

    BC has been a massive screw up for Sony this gen. Sad really, as they seem to be banging the drum about getting all those PS2 owners to upgrade to PS3, yet surely ensuring PS3 BC would have been one of the main advantages to current PS2 owners.

    So short sighted of them.

    #3 6 years ago
  4. Shatner

    The BC isn’t so short sighted as you think. Sony are still selling profitable PS2s. Why stifle that revenue by having people’s only PS2 option as having to buy your unprofitable PS3?

    BC in PS3s has never been purely software, it’s always been a combination of 2 chips + emulator or 1 chip plus emulator.

    #4 6 years ago
  5. morriss

    They’ve already admitted it doesn’t cost them anything to have it in anymore. Maybe they should remove the Blu-ray player instead? They’d sell millions! ;)

    #5 6 years ago
  6. Shatner

    My point wasn’t about the cost of manufacturing with BC chips in. My point was that they have a demand for PS2 and two machines that could meet that demand. Of the two machines one makes them significantly more money than the other one. So, unsurprisingly, they’re going with the more profitable option and controlling their product flow to maximise the profit they can get from it.

    #6 6 years ago
  7. morriss

    But they’d sell more PS3s if BC was in it. I have no empirical evidence to back this up but just about everyone I’ve spoken to about it – whether industry types or just the man on the street – agrees.

    If it doesn’t cost anything, put it back in, advertise that they’ve put it back in, and sit back and watch as PS2 owners start to make the transition.

    All imo, of course.

    #7 6 years ago
  8. Gamoc

    I agree with Morriss.

    #8 6 years ago
  9. ecu

    I don’t. It works in theory, but I don’t think there’s that huge of a demand for backwards compatibility. Their best option is still to force people to buy the profitable PS2, not the PS3. Putting BC back in PS3 would be a bonus, but it wouldn’t create a noticeable surge in sales.

    #9 6 years ago
  10. Shatner

    But they’d sell more PS3s if BC was in it. I have no empirical evidence to back this up but just about everyone I’ve spoken to about it – whether industry types or just the man on the street – agrees.

    Yes. They’d sell more of their no-profit machine at the expense of not selling the profit-making machine.

    That’s not really good business sense though, is it?

    #10 6 years ago
  11. morriss

    I take it software sales mean nothing any more?

    #11 6 years ago
  12. Shatner

    They mean a lot. Who would you rather sell software to: 10 million customers or 100 million customers?

    And, of the two platforms, one has significantly lower development overheads than the other.

    #12 6 years ago
  13. ecu

    But morriss, do you really think BC in the PS3 would boost consoles sales so significantly as to cover the profits lost on PS2? I really doubt it.

    #13 6 years ago
  14. Psychotext

    So they make a BC model that covers the cost difference. Sell the non BC model for whatever they can cut it down to, then sell the premium model for a nice chunk more.

    #14 6 years ago
  15. Xephon1970

    It makes financial sense to continue to support the PlayStation 2, it still sells really well, I have first hand experience.

    As for BC, both Sony and Microsoft handled it quite poorly in this generation, and with Microsoft now selling Xbox originals via XBLA, PlayStation 2 titles shouldn’t be too much of a surprise on the PSN.

    Having said all that, most people still like to have physical product, and the sale of pre-owned games on both consoles is still very much alive.

    #15 6 years ago
  16. Shatner

    Psychotext, the cost of BC isn’t the issue. The existence of any BC enabled PS3 directly harms the chances of earning revenue from the sales of the considerbaly more profitable PS2.

    Yes, arguing all the reasons it should exist, from a consumer point of view, is all well and good. But why would any business favour no-profit over profit?

    #16 6 years ago
  17. Psychotext

    Doesn’t explain the fully BC PS2 when they were still selling boatloads of the PS1. It’s just desperation in the face of poor PS3 sales… but it does nothing to help the PS3 long term.

    #17 6 years ago
  18. Shatner

    I think the sitauation for Sony’s console transition from PS1 to PS2 was quite different nearly a decade or so ago than it is for the PS2 > PS3 transition today. The market and Sony’s objectives (Blu ray, unrivalled strength of PS2, no competition running in “last-gen” market) is wildly different. Comparisons between the two eras don’t really hold much water. Sony are acting based on the situation today, not the situation 8 years ago.

    Also “this does nothing to help the PS3 long term”. You forget (or choose to ignore) that Sony aren’t just about the PS3. Sony’s choices benefit Sony. Choosing to ignore relevant factors in their business actions is, understandably, going to lead to some head scratching. When remember that Sony’s game division earns money from more than just the PS3 then things make a little more sense.

    Software and the uptake of PS3 will help the PS3 long-term. As will price-drops on hardware and software. BC isn’t required to help the PS3 longterm. Just because anecdotal evidence from a handful of people state they’d like BC doesn’t mean that it’s a well thought out, calculated business forecast that Sony should jump on. Right now PS3 BC would do Sony far more harm than good and most people, despite anecdotal evidence on the internet, couldn’t give a toss.

    A while back in another topic I asked:

    How many PS1 games did you play on your PS2. And how many PS1 games did you PURCHASE after you had your PS2.

    No answer. Maybe because real-world evidence suggests that BC isn’t really that much of deal. People always want whatever’s not available. The lure of BC is because it’s not there. If it was there most people, as evidenced by lack of response to my PS1 on PS2 question, really couldn’t care less.

    #18 6 years ago
  19. Psychotext

    I run a business… and this is a beancounter decision if I’ve ever seen one. It’s a typical move that helps short term profitability (to appease shareholders) whilst damaging long term profitability and brand growth.

    #19 6 years ago
  20. Newbie101

    “But they’d sell more PS3s if BC was in it. I have no empirical evidence to back this up but just about everyone I’ve spoken to about it – whether industry types or just the man on the street – agrees.”

    I think missing BC is a shame but I really don’t think that they will sell less because of it. A very small percentage of consumers who buy a PS3 will care about BC. Obviously we will, as we are gamers, read up on gaming etc… but the vast majority of the general public won’t.

    Obviously we do as we live games but people going in to GAME on a Saturday afternoon will think ‘Ooo 80gig cool’.
    This in prep. for the downloadable media no doubt…

    #20 6 years ago
  21. Shatner

    Psychotext,

    PlayStation brand is healthy. It’s across four products, three of which are currently on the market.

    Your appraisal seems to want to deliberately ignore the majority of the brand (PS2 and PSP and even PlayStation 1) in favour of insisting that what YOU want in the minority market is worth cannibalising the majority market for.

    Why choose failure over success? Because some guy on the internet wants something today that probably won’t care about tomorrow?

    If you cared about the brand you’d not ignore so much of it. PS3 specific brand growth will be far better served by pimping it’s unique features like software exclusives and blu-ray than putting in BC anyway. You don’t grow brand growth of a specific product by saying “Hey! We just made it like our old product!” (witness Wii and DS brand identity – both of which feature BC as standard) – if anything you do more damage to the brand than good. And, in this specific scenario, you’d lose revenue and profit too.

    Not a good business choice at all.

    #21 6 years ago
  22. Psychotext

    Sony continuously talk about how they’re going to win by grabbing a large chunk of the PS2 owners. With BC they had an easy upgrade path… sell the console, keep your games and use the money toward getting a PS3. Without it they might as well pick any console (and based on sales, they are).

    That’s where they’ve hurt their long term sales for short term profitability. Not even mentioning leveraging the best back catalogue of all the current consoles to sell via the PSN. You can talk brand as much as you like… but their flagship product is struggling and the PS2′s sales peaked a very, very long time ago.

    #22 6 years ago
  23. Newbie101

    The PS3 isn’t struggling at all its sold more than the 360 in Europe which says it all.

    Sony have a NEW PS2 coming out soon so WHY would they want to hurt sales of that by adding BC to the PS3.

    #23 6 years ago
  24. Shatner

    So,

    Sony should be happy to get PS2 owners to buy the PS3 but only as a means to play games they already own on it?

    Again, that’s a very limited business model. What’s the point of using the “lose money on hardware, make it on software” method that console manufacturers use if you’re trying to tell me that PS2 owners will just carry on playing games they already own?

    It makes more business sense to lure PS2 owners to PS3 with the promise of continue PS2 franchise made sexy by PS3′s.. whatever. Singstar already does this – and PS3 add online into the PS2′s popular game. God of War. Wipeout. Ratchet and Clank. Killzone etc. It’s these assets that are used to identify with the PS2 market and then get them to SPEND MONEY on the PS3 market. BC is practically worthless.

    Why on earth would you shoot your PS2 golden goose just so you can watch people buy your unprofitable PS3 AND not buy much software for it either?

    Doubly bad business decision on top of an already bad one.

    These argument are coming from a consumer viewpoint, pure and simple. You’re seeing all the things you want as a consumer and refusing to see how this works as a business.

    Businesses shouldn’t kill sales, limit revenue, ignore profit and then create a no-win loss leader business model. Not if they want to stay in business – yet you’re claiming they should do all these things.

    If you’re so fond of throwing away money, could you give some to me please? :)

    And still: nobody answers my “what old games did you buy to play on BC” question.

    People like the idea of BC because they want what they can’t have. Give it to them and they stop caring. This is all about the desire for the unattainable. It’s not something that people genuinely want to use. If it was, loads of people would have given me a list of all the old games they bought exclusively to play through BC. How many Gamecube games have you bought for your Wii? How many Xbox games have you bought for your 360? How many GBA games have you bought for your DS? How many GBC games have you bought for your GBA?

    In reality, people don’t care for BC that much. They just want what they can’t have.

    #24 6 years ago
  25. Psychotext

    That’s a large strawman you’ve constructed there Shatner. Well done.

    The PS2 isn’t their golden goose. It’s not got the hardware sales and it certainly doesn’t have the software sales any more. I appreciate you have a vested interest in Sony’s success but that doesn’t mean you have to believe that every decision they’re making is the right one – as much as it feels like you should.

    …and again. I’m a businessman first. Gamer second. If you think that they’re luring PS2 owners with PS2 franchises, that’s fine. But the numbers show otherwise – especially on titles like Singstar, Buzz etc. This isn’t about shooting the goose – it’s about desperately clinging to it whilst waiting for rescue.

    Newbie: 360′s lack of success is a completely separate topic. If you want to see why the PS3 is struggling – look at Sony’s profit figures over the last few years. Look at their sales vs the PS2 over similar timelines. Look at what’s happened in Japan. Look at how they had to rip the arse out of its functionality to get the price down and get people buying it.

    #25 6 years ago
  26. Blerk

    It’s somewhat amusing how full BC was an excellent idea and one of Sony’s strongest USPs when it was first announced, but is now pointless and business-ruining and you-never-used-it-anyway now that it’s been taken away.

    #26 6 years ago
  27. Newbie101

    Ok, at the end of the day if sony are failing then MS have failed. (the facts are in the figures, end of discussion).

    Back on topic, sony have a NEW PS2 coming out soon, wouldnt that be why the PS3 has no BC perhaps????

    #27 6 years ago
  28. Blerk

    No. The PS3 has no BC because Sony want you to buy PS3 games instead of playing your old ones.

    #28 6 years ago
  29. Shatner

    A straw man? Here’s a good one for you:

    How about making a massive argument on the basis that “BC is necessary for PS3′s success” when it’s evidently not? For a multitude of simple reasons that I’ve pointed out and that others have added to.

    Get over it. BC isn’t happening whilst PS2 remains out there and profitable and no amount of arm-waving or selective statistical information is going to make it happen. Sony know their market a million times better than you do. It’s just a horribly conceived plan that people like the sound of simply because they can’t have it.

    You’ve not answered my repeated questions about game bought for the purpose of BC. You could burn that particular straw man if you wished, but you’re choosing not to. Maybe it’s not made of straw after all eh? ;)

    #29 6 years ago
  30. Psychotext

    Clarify your questions and I’ll answer every one. I apologise if I find it hard to stay attentive through your recycled arguments.

    Is BC necessary for PS3 success? No, of course not… the GameCube showed you can be a success without selling 50m+ units. Have they made it far less likely that a PS2 owner (130m of them allegedly) will have a no brainer upgrade to the PS3? Yes. I guess you know nobody that bought a PS2 because all the games they had on the PS1 worked on it? It’s strange, because Sony has pointed to those upgrade statistics time and time again…

    …and listed the all important BC as part of the PlayStation DNA.

    #30 6 years ago
  31. Blerk

    The trouble is, the PS2 effect is over. The last set of Sony results showed that PS3 software sales were massively up, but overall software sales were still down for the year because the arse has fallen out of the PS2 software sales, and the PSP doesn’t actually sell any software at all.

    I don’t think Sony *needed* PS2 BC to sell the PS3, but they really should have made their decision at the beginning and stuck with it. It was either in or out, not ‘in for a bit and then out and possibly out forever but oh no we might hint that it might come back no it’s gone’. It doesn’t help sell the machine to the people who were interested in it and are now sitting on the fence waiting to see if a new model emerges.

    #31 6 years ago
  32. Newbie101

    Blerk I do agree with you to an extent.

    They want PS3 owners to buy PS3 games and not PS2 games.

    BUT they still want PS2 games in the market as they are bringing out a new model. It makes business sense do ditch BC from the PS3 as it would be a competitor for the PS2.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if Sony ditched BC from the PS3 once they decided to make the new PS2…

    #32 6 years ago
  33. Blerk

    There’s nothing ‘new’ about the new PS2, though – it’s just yet another hardware revision of the same thing (how many PS2 models have we had now – 15 or so?). They revise the hardware so that it’s cheaper to manufacture, there won’t be a relaunch or anything like that.

    #33 6 years ago
  34. Shatner

    Psychotext, you’re funny. When you quote Sony you like to quote 2 year old statements as though nothing has happened between then and now. All companies make statements and, guess what? Things change! Clinging onto things said years ago at the expense of all the stuff said and done in between is, again, a very selective way of arguing.

    Bill Gates said “640k should be enough for anyone”. So shall we have nice long aguments about what a failing Windows is as an operating system because it demands more than 640k? That Bill – what a fool! He’ll never get anywhere and that Windows thing is DOOMED!!!

    Selective comprehension and cherry picking details at the expense of other factors is only going to result in a flawed argument. Stop doing it. Stop comparing today to 8 years ago. Stop making ridiculous claims about Sony’s “brand” when you carefully ignore 90% of it. BC aint happening. It doesn’t need to happen. It’s not going to change PS3′s fortunes one way or another. PS2 owners will be presented with different ways to go to PS3 should Sony want them. BC is a complete and utter non-event. It’s just raised as a point for people to argue about. Its only significance is in debate. If BC mattered in the real world you’d have some real world evidence to support it. That’s why I asked you some very clear, very direct questions.

    BC is the ultimate straw man.

    I’m going to make a videogame where the main character is a straw man. And he gets targeted by flames. It’s going to be all self-referential and post-modern. I’ll put it on XBL at a ‘premium’ price, make some references to Mario, put in some pretentious text. Eurogamer will love it. $$$$$$$

    #34 6 years ago
  35. Blerk

    How much money have Microsoft made from downloadable vanilla-Xbox games? Anyone know?

    #35 6 years ago
  36. Psychotext

    Were you going to ask some questions Shatner? Or were you just going to avoid it by using the same arguments again? Perhaps you’d like to have another dig at a successful game instead? Maybe you’d like to reference Eurogamer or join the Newbie crowd and mash M$ into the keyboard?

    BC is clearly a non issue in the real world. It’s a non issue because we’re talking about it. It’s a non issue because people ate up the remaining PS3 BC models like candy. It’s a non issue because customers are confused that the new model PS3s wont play their PS2 games. It’s a non issue because it’s something even casual gamers ask about in shops. It’s a non issue because it’s gone.

    It’ll be a huge issue if Sony were ever to bring it back via software. I guarantee it.

    #36 6 years ago
  37. Newbie101

    PT I’ve never mashed MS. I own all three consoles.

    I’m sorry if stating the facts that the PS3 has sold more in Europe than the 360 and the fact I feel Braid is over priced makes me a Sony fanboy.

    #37 6 years ago
  38. Shatner

    I’ve asked you clear questions repeatedly in these comments.

    Might I suggest you re-read what I’ve already written. I’d rather not write things a third time just to be ignored. Again.

    BC IS a non issue in the real world. If you’re suggesting that people talking about something on the internet makes something real then you’re deluded. Internet isn’t real life. A thousand angry fanboys may be loud on the internet but they mean sod all in real life. Really, you talk about straw men but you fail to see the ones your rely upon in every comment that you make!

    BC means sod all apart from giving self-righteous gamers something to witter on about. As you’ve repeatedly dodged my repeated questions it shows you’d rather TALK about BC than use it.

    So, by all rights you should be happy. You already have the thing you want. :D

    #38 6 years ago
  39. Truk

    I think BC isn’t that important either. Maybe to some hardcore gamers, but to most people? Nah. And the hardcore’s importance is shrinking by the day.

    #39 6 years ago
  40. Blerk

    The idea of BC is much more important than the reality. People think they want it, but rarely use it. But it’s one of those ‘tick the box’ things that makes a system more appealing when you’re thinking of buying.

    #40 6 years ago
  41. DrDamn

    I agree about the importance of BC – it’s not all that to be honest. I think we are also missing the more important point in this discussion. B/C is not coming back in hardware because Sony plans to do it in software. It’s only a matter of time before PS2 games become downloadable from PSN to run on an emulator – surely? So why would they bother with the hardware route anymore?

    #41 6 years ago
  42. Newbie101

    Why are we arguing then, or is it just PT making us :D.

    BC would be nice and more appealing = FACT
    Not having BC has NOT affected PS3 sales = FACT
    PS3 install base is higher in Europe than the 360 = FACT

    #42 6 years ago
  43. Psychotext

    Shatner: I’m talking about people in the real world… normal customers in normal shops asking if they can play their PS2 games on the PS3 and if that functionality is ever coming back. I guess you aren’t reading my posts either. Oh well.

    DrDamn: Sony have said very clearly that BC is gone, for good. If you’re waiting for them to spend millions developing a full software solution you may be waiting a very long time indeed.

    Newbie: Why are you going on about the 360? It’s irrelevant to the discussion. If you want to join in with the adults, take a leaf out of Shatner’s book. He may be batshit mental but he’s capable of constructing a relatively reasoned argument.

    #43 6 years ago
  44. Blerk

    Not having BC has NOT affected PS3 sales = FACT

    Er… no. Not FACT. Possible, but not in any way provable.

    #44 6 years ago
  45. Shatner

    Psychotext, I’m reading your posts. But you’re not talking about people in the real world. You’re manufacturing anecdotal evidence to suit your view. Even if you had actually spoken to people in the real world it’s very unlikely you’re speaking to anyone but a very very small part of the market. And, again, depending on how you would choose to phrase the question I’m pretty certain you can get the answer you want. And even then, for any number of responses to carry weight, it’d have to compare to the number of PS3′s already sold and in people’s homes to mean anything. Categorically, how many real world people have said to you that they won’t be buying a PS3 until BC is in it?

    That’s a question. Feel free to answer it.

    Every point you’ve raised I’ve responded to. And when I do you just change tack. I respond to your “Sony should just make a premium BC model” with why they shouldn’t (and aren’t) and you change direction. You’ve flip-flopped around responding to every counterpoint by bringing out a different excuse each time. Going as far to rely on out-of-date quotes and willfully overlooking very significant factors just so you can keep insisting that Sony are wrong to throw away millions in revenue just so your messageboard rants can be appeased. Talk is cheap.

    You’ve also completely and utterly failed to give any value to the real-world application of BC by repeatedly ignoring my questions relating to it. You continue to do this and every instance you do just highlights the difference between the cute notion of BC and the reality of whether real people such as yourself would prefer to use it than argue about it. Your actions speak louder than your words! :D

    #45 6 years ago
  46. Psychotext

    Ok, I’ve personally spoken to 6 people in the real world that own PS2s and were put off buying PS3s because they can’t play their PS2 games on them. 3 of them have since gone on to sell their PS2 (and all games obviously) and bought Wiis. 2 haven’t made a decision yet. 1 bought a PS3 but kept his PS2.

    As for others. I’m friends with quite a few people that work in games retail and they inform me that they’re always being asked by customers if they can play their PS2 games on the PS3. You’re right, it’s absolutely anecdotal… but then again, so is the fact that all bar one person I know with a PS2 bought it because they could play their PS1 games on it.

    Lets play the real world game another way instead. BC PS3s sell for a significant premium on ebay and other second hand goods sites. Premium price = demand. Sony’s largest sales spikes of the PS3 in the US came with the re-introduction of PS2 BC. Not once, but twice. This time the argument is that the new model was popular because it has an 80gb HDD – that one is easy to put to the test.

    Sony are introducing a new bundle with dual shock 3 but no BC to the US soon. If people really aren’t interested in BC but want the bigger HDD we should see sales of the new model at least match sales of the now nearly sold out BC model. We wont have to wait long to find out.

    #46 6 years ago
  47. Shatner

    Anecdotal evidence is.. anecdotal. And faced with a guranteed loss of revenue, damage to the PS2 profit model and considerable negative impact against software sales to over 100 million customers it’s rather comical to think Sony are suddenly going to roll over and see it your way.

    And, you appear to have forgotten that the COST of the PS3s with BC aren’t an issue. Their EXISTENCE is where the problem lies. So why should Sony make problems for themselves that cost them money and damage their brand identity? Because some people on the internet like to rant and a handful of retail stores think they speak for a global corporation? Yeah. Um. I don’t think so. Maybe that’s why they’re working in retail and not running those global corporations, huh?

    And your final paragraph is a wonderful demonstration of your preference for selective comprehension. If you expect me to believe console sales (or any sales) are dictated base on one SINGLE factor (like the presence of virtually worthless BC) then, seriously, you’re just going to make yourself look very silly. When you selectively quote your selective stats you’ll have to insist that they’re based on nothing other than the absence of BC and absolutely no other factor whatsoever. And then, should you go down that fateful path, you may get asked to substantiate your findings beyond personal interpretation and anecdotal evidence. I think you’re setting yourself up for an impossible task but, hey, I guess you like a challenge.

    You STILL continue to fail to show any real world worth in BC by STILL not answering some very simple, very direct questions.

    I appreciated the answer to my last question in that post before your most recent one. It made me lol. I mentioned it to 6 of my friends and they told me they would lol too. Two of those mates know people who are comedians, so their lols count for a lot.

    #47 6 years ago
  48. Psychotext

    You asked me a question. I answered it. Whether you enjoyed that answer is irrelevant. At some point you’ll realise that your perspective on this issue is no more valid than mine… they’re all just opinions.

    …and please make your mind up. Either Sony are doing this to protect their PS2 profit model or BC doesn’t matter because no-one other than internet nutters want it. The two are mutually exclusive. Besides that, if a PS3 owner has PS2 BC you can sell them PS3 and PS2 games. It makes absolutely no difference to software sales to PS2 owners.

    #48 6 years ago
  49. Shatner

    Either Sony are doing this to protect their PS2 profit model or BC doesn’t matter because no-one other than internet nutters want it. The two are mutually exclusive.

    They are? I think not.

    PS2 sales due to PS2 demand is one thing.

    The worth of BC in consoles is something else entirely. (And by dismissing it, you’re also dismissing the opinions expressed by more people than just me.)

    I’ve referred to it in my questions (you’ve still not answered them) and I’ve also substantiated that point with reference to Wii and DS brand identity. The longer you refuse to answer those questions the more you do to prove me right. :D

    #49 6 years ago
  50. Newbie101

    “Ok, I’ve personally spoken to 6 people in the real world that own PS2s and were put off buying PS3s because they can’t play their PS2 games on them. 3 of them have since gone on to sell their PS2 (and all games obviously) and bought Wiis. 2 haven’t made a decision yet. 1 bought a PS3 but kept his PS2.”

    Are them people the ones in your office? If so you work within a develop environment (lionhead isn’t it?) thus will be like us.

    Ask random people on the street ;).

    #50 6 years ago
  51. Psychotext

    Shatner: As I said, you’ll need to ask them again… clearly. Your posts tend to be overly long and lacking direction so I’d rather not have to trawl through them again.

    As for PS2 sales, there’s really not a lot to talk about. Taking from Sony’s own figures (Jan – Jun 07 vs Jan – Jun 08):

    PS2 HW 07: 2.66m units
    PS2 HW 08: 1.51m units (43% decrease)

    PS2 SW 07: 31.1m units
    PS2 SW 08: 19.3m units (38% decrease)

    …so I’d say that holding onto that to the detriment of your new flagship product might not be the best plan. I’m sure you’ll disagree though.

    #51 6 years ago
  52. Shatner

    And as I said, I’ve already presented them twice. You’ve ignored them twice. I already stated I won’t ask them a third time because I don’t see why I should repeat myself AGAIN for you to ignore me AGAIN. As you repeatedly ignore me I’m not sure I particularly care for what you’re rather or not do. Besides, the more lame excuses you provide for not answering questions the deeper a hole you dig for yourself. :D

    PS2 sales don’t have to be much to talk about, it’s the profit margin that counts. Duh. You still choose to ignore profitability (probably because you can’t copy-and-paste it into a post to make your comments look more meaningful). Kinda silly thing to overlook really. Especially when you’re in the business of making money. Oh well.

    I’d say that one week of PS2 sales amount to more profit that any PS3s that would ONLY have been sold due to the presence of BC (assuming the PS3 was profitable, duh). Of course, you’ll never be able to disprove that because you’ll never be able to prove WHY something sold (which is why your earlier comment about a new PS3 bundle and comparing sales stats is tragically misjudged but promises to be very entertaining when someone asks you for the MEANING in your copy-and-pasted numbers). Which is why quoting context-free stats is hilariously pointless. Any fool can make numbers mean whatever they like. Pulling stats out this late in the conversation is quite comical.

    #52 6 years ago
  53. DrDamn

    @Shatner
    “DrDamn: Sony have said very clearly that BC is gone, for good. If you’re waiting for them to spend millions developing a full software solution you may be waiting a very long time indeed.”

    I don’t need to wait I’ve got a 60G UK machine. It’s clearly an obvious and logical step though and even goes some way to explaining the current situation.

    Obvious because it allows them to sell a load of PS2 titles as downloads. Logical as they already do this for PSOne titles.

    Is it really going to cost them millions? They are ready have some of the required software in place it just needs extension. The emulation software should be easier for them to write than it has been for MS in emulating the XBox.

    There have even been a couple of bits of evidence that this is in the offing too. Screenshots of PS2 titles on the PSN store (possible fake) but also I’ve seen shots of FFXII emulation which look a hell of a lot better than it does running on a BC PS3 as it clearly rendered the stuff at 720p rather than upscaled it.

    #53 6 years ago
  54. Psychotext

    Ahhh… yes, the profit margin on the PS2 is everything. Well, if that’s the case they probably should have never released the PS3 because of how much money it lost them.

    Stupid Sony, should have paid more attention to Shatner. (See beancounter decision, noted near the start of this topic)

    #54 6 years ago
  55. Psychotext

    DrDamn: From a technical standpoint it’s a difficult nut to crack. The PS2 GPU had a ludicrously high fillrate that they’ve somehow got to match using the PS3 CPU / GPU.

    You can do it on the PC (that’s where you’ve seen the FFXII emulation shots from), but only if you’ve got a GPU that can overpower it.

    #55 6 years ago
  56. Shatner

    No Psychotext, it’s not everything but allow me to boil it down to you:

    You’re a business.

    Do you go for

    a) profit
    b) no profit

    ?

    According to your anecdotal ranting, Sony should be choosing option B as it makes the most sense.

    Your insistence on comparing launches of two SEPARATE products 8 years apart whilst selectively ignoring every single other factor that occurs over those 8 years is tragically flawed. You even suggest they should have stuck with the PS2.

    GUESS WHAT? They’re still sticking with the PS2! Weclome to the debate, I’m so glad you could make it. :D

    As ever, you’re still not answering questions and you’re still flip-flopping from one failed excuse to another. You’re currently-rehashing your earlier failed excuses.

    #56 6 years ago
  57. Blerk

    Software-only PS2 emulation is very difficult to actually achieve because of the bizarre hardware used in the PS2′s graphics chip. In some ways it’s actually more powerful than the PS3′s RSX, iirc.

    A software solution on a ‘game by game’ basis might be possible, but I’m not convinced we’ll ever see ‘one emulator runs all’ BC on the PS3. With next-gen costs rising and Sony profits faltering, you can certainly see why they’d want to put all of their efforts into PS3 software instead.

    #57 6 years ago
  58. Psychotext

    You’re a business.

    Do you go for:

    a) Long term profit
    b) Short term profit

    Not everything is as black and white as you make it. I could sell my buildings right now and make a tidy profit indeed… but then I’d do major damage to my future profits because I’d have to rent the space.

    Do you make Office 2003 incompatible with Office 2000 documents because you make more profit on Office 2000 sales?

    Do you make a blu-ray player that can’t play DVDs because you make more profit on your DVD hardware?

    #58 6 years ago
  59. Psychotext

    Anyway… as entertaining as this has been, I should probably go and do something productive or I’ll be sacrificing my profits too. \o/

    #59 6 years ago
  60. Shatner

    You’re a business.

    Do you go for:

    a) Long term profit
    b) Short term profit

    The beauty of having more than one product on the market is that you can go with

    c) Both

    So long as you don’t purposefully design one product to cripple the profitability of the other product.

    Office: no, you give incentive of sales of your old product by SHOCK HORROR lowering the price of the old product!!!!

    BRD: Does anyone make a BR player that doesn’t play DVDs or are you just fabricating another scenario that has no relevance in the real world???

    Thanks for still avoiding my questions and validating my point about the worth of BC.

    THANKS FOR PLAYING – SEE YOU NEXT GAME! :D

    #60 6 years ago
  61. Psychotext

    As I said, put them down and I’ll answer them. You can’t blame me for not wanting to read all that you’ve written again but it would take you two seconds to re-ask the questions as they’re clearly in your head.

    #61 6 years ago
  62. wz

    I fully agree with Shatner. Sony has a product pipeline still in place for the PS2, it’s running great (given it’s age), and it’s profitable.

    But surely, no one would spend 400€ for a PS3 just to get it for playing PS2 games, right? Perfectly right. It’s not about selling more PS3 units for PS2 units, but selling the ultra-cheap PS2s alongside the PS3.

    Maybe only a fraction of the people who’d use the BC feature of the PS3 would also spend another 130€ on the PS2, but those are the people for which BC was a USP, an important feature. The others are the crowd that did not care much about the BC in the first place.

    #62 6 years ago
  63. J@m

    BC aside, ive seen HMV advertising the 80GB for GAME at a release price that is the same as the 40GB. Does anyone know if they plan to lower the price for the 40GB and if so by how much and when?

    Any information would be appreciated.

    #63 6 years ago
  64. morriss

    Funny:

    Today I had a conversation with some bloke at work: Casual gamer, not into his games or anything, likes his GTA and PS2.

    He told me he was playing San Andreas last night and thought it was great and that he had to get a PS3 soon so he could play GTA4. We chatted a bit about 360/PS3: price, games etc. when I mentioned that unfortunately the ‘new’ (compared to my 60Gb PS3) 40Gb model doesn’t play PS2 games.

    “Wow, that’s fucking terrible,” he said.

    Isn’t anecdotal evidence great?

    #64 6 years ago
  65. OrphanageExplosion

    If Sony had this brilliant masterplan about not cannibalising their PS2 sales, why did they put BC in the PS3 to begin with? Why was it a major component of the PS2?

    PS2 and PS3 appeal to entirely different audiences. There is no careful consideration amongst Joe Public between Machine A and Machine B – one costs over three times as much as the other! One is bought by enthusiast gamers, the other bought by parents for young children.

    BC was there because originally, as Uncle Phil said, being able to carry over your games to the next platform was all part of the PlayStation brand. This very good reasoning disappeared down the toilet when it became apparent how much of a financial blackhole PS3 was becoming – it was nothing to do with share-stealing from PS2.

    #65 6 years ago
  66. morriss

    I like BC because there’s still a few PS2 I need to play, like God War 2 and I don’t need to buy a new console in order to do so.

    #66 6 years ago
  67. Killerbee

    I’ll be getting an 80GB, but I will definitely still be annoyed that they took BC out of it – yes, I can keep my PS2 so it’s not the end of the world but having one box that plays all my Playstation games would’ve been nice.

    That said, I can see why Sony did it – promote PS3 games to PS3 owners; let the PS2 carry on being profitable at the bottom end of the market. Don’t let one cannibalise sales of the other.

    I’m sure they’re right that most consumers won’t give a toss about PS2 BC within a year or two. They just axed it way too early. Not all hardcore gamers are early adopters – if they axed BC when launching the PSThree Slim&Lite (or whatever) then fair enough, but the 60GB was only available for about 8-9 months. Plus they managed to piss off the hardcore by messing around with a load of different SKUs in different territories – and, of course, by shafting Europe the worst of anyone.

    Still, no change there then.

    #67 6 years ago
  68. Blerk

    Game now say August 22nd. Is that old news?

    #68 6 years ago