Sections

Xbox One u-turns: was Microsoft wrong to listen to you?

Tuesday, 6th August 2013 12:53 GMT By Dave Cook

Xbox One’s big policy reversals have sparked a great deal of debate this year. VG247′s Dave Cook looks at this week’s comments from Jesse Schell and ponders if Microsoft should have stuck to its guns.

Yesterday I wrote a news report based on comments that came from veteran game designer Jesse Schell.

He suggested that the one of the biggest mistakes any company can make when looking to innovate and bring about change is to listen to its customers too closely, and then change tack based on what they say.

Schell feels that Microsoft is one of these companies, given its steps to address user concerns by revoking several deeply-ingrained policies such as 24-hour DRM authentication, anti-used policies and blocking the right to self-publish. I wrote a blog piece on the latter here.

During his interview with GI.biz he said, “Your customers want you to stay the same, even if it drives you into the ground. Somehow, Microsoft didn’t seem to think that would be a reality, or even a problem. The reality is that they can’t do what the customers want.

“Basically, Microsoft said, ‘We’re going to be Steam. You like Steam, don’t you?’ And we all said, ‘No, we hate that. We hate you. You’re an idiot to do that.’ They came out and said, ‘We’re gonna do this new thing.’ And the customers said, ‘No, we don’t want that, we hate that’ – even though it’s what they really want and what they will ultimately buy.

“So now Microsoft has had to say they won’t do all that stuff, but someone will.”

The comments follow a heated blog on the matter from Cliff Bleszinski, who believes that Microsoft’s seemingly heavy-handed approach to the used market was formulated with the best interests of developers in mind. The former Epic Games designer claimed as long as pre-owned is allowed to exist on consoles, the glut of DLC and amount of publishers in financial bother will increase.

Like them or not, agree with them or not; these are two very smart individuals who aren’t simply howling from the rooftops in a bid to stir up trouble, raise their profile or make a name for themselves. This is what they believe, and instead of simply lambasting them as consumers we do need to ask ourselves why they believe Microsoft was right and how this applies from a developer’s perspective.

Schell offered that perhaps the big hoopla over Xbox One’s policies was because people don’t like change and that being first out the gate with such seismic policies is a path fraught with danger. While I think Microsoft’s delivery and explanation of what it was trying to achieve was best described as an ‘Omnishambles’, I agree with Schell on this point.

We often don’t like change and sometimes ambition can get ahead of practicality. Look at the Dreamcast; it was the first Western console to offer online play and for many of us it was a dream come true. The reality was that for a lot of gamers the console’s connection was slow, costly and unreliable. It may not have been perfect, but it can be argued that it inspired Xbox 360 and PS3 to make something bigger and better based on Sega’s original blueprint. The same goes for the transition between Dreamcast controller and Xbox 360 pad.

Historically the games industry is full of non-starters and also-rans. Back in the day we had Nintendo’s Virtual Boy while today we have Oculus Rift; two similar concepts that are both revolutionary in their ambition but handled with different degrees of success based on the tech at hand. This is an iterative industry that does evolve over time and naturally, mistakes will be made along the way.

Schell also compared Xbox One’s DRM structure to Steam and suggested that the only reason Valve could have got away with its own store-front is because it didn’t have such a marketplace before Steam launched. There was nothing in the gaming space to compare it to.

He said, “When you want to do something really different – the solution to the innovator’s dilemma – you can’t take your big brand and say it’s going to be completely different. You need to set up something up on the side, and big companies are hesitant to do that. It’s how Valve could do it [with Steam], because they had nothing before.

“I suspect that we’re going to end up in that world. Are we going to end up there on these consoles? I don’t know. It could be that some dark horse shows up. It could be that Apple shows up. It could be that somebody finds a better way.”

That last line – “It could be that somebody finds a better way” – is important. I personally believe that Microsoft’s communication of what it was trying to achieve in its online policies was poor at best, and I agree that blocking used sales is hardly a solution for the cash-strapped gamer. The silence on Xbox Live self-publishing was also achingly uncomfortable to watch with each passing day.

However, as we move towards a digital-only future – which I firmly believe will happen down the line – someone, somewhere will take what Microsoft set out to do with Xbox One and make it better, fairer, more practical and on terms that benefit most parties. I think the bricks and mortar stores aren’t going to like it, but to make progress sometimes sacrifices do need to be made.

Was Microsoft wrong to listen to you? Not at all, but I think that your collective noise and voiced concerns will make whoever attempts this model next do so with greater respect and consideration for you, their paying customers.

Either way, it’ll be interesting to see who steps up to the plate after Microsoft’s strike-out.

Breaking news

120 Comments

Sign in to post a comment.

  1. redwood

    http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130325203343/walkingdead/images/7/74/And-here-we-go-eccbc87e4b5ce2fe28308fd9f2a7baf3-1271.gif

    #1 11 months ago
  2. DGOJG

    Great piece Dave. Personally, I definitely think they made a mistake but not so much on their policies but they way they handled everything. If they had presented everything in a much more coherent and positive way without jumping back and forth on everything we might have seen a viable option for future consoles. I disagreed with a lot of what was proposed like the 24 hour check ins etc but there was still some stuff that would have been beneficial to expand on.

    @1 Surely that should have been this? http://i.imgur.com/VurPClv.gif

    #2 11 months ago
  3. Old MacDonald

    I think many of these games industry guys who support Microsoft’s original plans only see things from their own perspective – as established game industry guys. The thing is that what is best for them is not always best for us or even gaming as a whole.

    Will the future be 99% digital? Absolutely. But as this article says, it really needs to be “better, fairer, more practical and on terms that benefit most parties” than what Microsoft wanted. Or wants; let’s not think they’ve changed their minds about their goals just because they’ve changed their minds about how to achieve them.

    #3 11 months ago
  4. Lengendaryboss

    @Dave
    Great piece as always but i’m sad @redwood beat me to that gif :( ;)

    No MS wasn’t wrong to listen to consumers as it is them who will buying this product and having to deal with it (Nice choice of words).

    But i have already went into detail about it.

    #4 11 months ago
  5. Dave Cook

    @3 Yeah that’s the feeling I get as well. Some might call those devs ignorant, but they’re in a tricky place where they want to appease their paying fans and self-preserve by making enough money to function. I’m sure it’s not an easy place to be in for some studios, particularly those on the fringe of small-mid tier looking to grow.

    #5 11 months ago
  6. Aullah

    I really liked the original concept… the problem was the communications. They should have talk more about the benefits, the good things. And look at it now. The 2 consoles are almost identical.

    #6 11 months ago
  7. Dave Cook

    @6 I agree with that to a degree yeah, there’s not much to separate them bar exclusives again, but those policies needed addressing in some way. In their original form they weren’t good.

    #7 11 months ago
  8. polygem

    the idea was great but they only offered restrictions and no benefits for the consumer. they did sell it so very very bad. they should´ve announced a pricing model with it, a good and fair one, announce some sales, you know…actually sell the idea to the guys you want to sell it to by showing them why it is awesome.
    they could have easily introduced better pricing models way before the x1 reveal for the 360 so people would have gained trust in the xbox brand. show people why the brand is great and buying into the x1 services will be cool. but look at games on demand pricing, look at all that stuff behind xbl paywalls. very unattractive service…then you add more restrictions to it but keep the same pricing structure and wonder that people do not write you love letters???
    they just did a shit job, in fact they tried to get away with their idea of monopolising the market and dictate their price and they so deserved to fail with this.
    they will think this through again now and will come up with a fairer deal, so no, it´s great that they u-turned, they will get there step by step now and it will be better for the industry as a whole and for the consumer. nothing is lost. they tried to force it and they failed. now they should look for realistic and fairer solutions – if steambox wont steal the show now that is.
    i for one wont buy into ms´s stuff ever again. the one reveal truly was an eye opener for me. i was shocked what they did there, how less they cared about their audience, how aggressive they were and how out of touch really. two words: fuck them.

    #8 11 months ago
  9. DrDamn

    @Dave
    Great article. As other have picked out this nails it … “better, fairer, more practical and on terms that benefit most parties.”. Some elements of what they proposed were misunderstood and so the communication issue was at fault there. They could have done more though.

    They should also have kept the good features for digital purchases – don’t see what they couldn’t have. If you want your customers to go digital then more carrot and less stick.

    I would also question the involvement of retail in the whole affair. Were MS just listening to customers? Or were the likes of Gamestop instrumental in the policy change too? MS may have considered riding it out, but without the backing of retail I’m not sure that was feasible.

    #9 11 months ago
  10. mark_t50

    I think there is a big danger in people basically saying “people did not like XboxOne, therefore people do not like change’. Maybe it is time people looked at the possibility that Microsoft just plain got it wrong on many fronts with their initial pitch for XboxOne.

    I am not afraid of change, if a company was to release a console that embraced a digital future in a way that was consumer friendly, did not require an always on connection, provided customers with a rich online and digital experience without feeling the need to kill off physical games, genuinely provide competitive pricing for digital games much like steam does etc. Heck, I salivate at the thoughts of such a device, unfortunately what I’ve just described is nothing like Microsoft pitched.

    imho there is far too much blaming the consumer going on at the moment for what Microsoft basically got wrong, this was not about customers being afraid of change or frightened of a digital future, this was simply Microsoft offering a warped, overly controlling and draconian visions of a digital future, and one that many consumers quite rightly did not like. It is not our fault, it is Microsofts.

    I firmly believe this is not the end for a digital future because luckily I think someone will come along with a better vision, especially in light of the beating Microsoft took, and as a result it will be a much more considerate and consumer friendly digital future.

    #10 11 months ago
  11. Dave Cook

    @9 thanks man. The one ‘good’ feature they should have kept was family sharing. I see no decent explanation as to why that feature had to be chopped following the first u-turn. It makes absolutely no sense to me.

    #11 11 months ago
  12. Dave Cook

    @10 “I firmly believe this is not the end for a digital future because luckily I think someone will come along with a better vision, especially in light of the beating Microsoft took, and as a result it will be a much more considerate and consumer friendly digital future”

    Spot on and it ties in with the end of my blog. I really believe that someday, some company will look at what Microsoft tried to do and use it as a guide of what not to do, but to still broker a better deal for everyone. It’ll take some doing, but it’s not impossible.

    #12 11 months ago
  13. JavelinX

    The Dreamcast didn’t die because it was ahead of its time, but because it was 1998 with Gt, Zelda ocarina, goldeneye tekken etc on the competitors. High price, low value. Much like the Wiiu right now. Just to say.

    DRM fuck no! Man I have no shame to say that sometime I buy cheap priced games, but I buy full priced too! So give me a grip, if you want more money, cut the cost, make funnier games, cut the bullshit like AAA title and stuff. Nintendo made 4 million dollars out of STREET PASS games!!!
    DRM won’t save Square-Enix from bankruptcy, until they make FF so boring and uninspired, DRM won’t let CliffB to buy a Ferrari. It’s a miracle that this industry still is alive and you want MORE money out of your customers…You’re crazy!

    #13 11 months ago
  14. Dave Cook

    @13 “The Dreamcast didn’t die because it was ahead of its time” That’s not what I was saying though. I was talking specifically about how it was the first console with online play in the west. It wasn’t the best online play, but it ushered in what we know today.

    That said, I love my Dreamcast. Still got it :D

    #14 11 months ago
  15. viralshag

    They should have stuck to their guns in my opinion. I think their ideas would have helped push console gaming forwards and eventually more in line with what we see on the PC.

    I think Schell is absolutely correct in not listening to customers too closely because frankly most of them can’t see beyond their overly passionate love for a hobby. Everything is a conspiracy and cash-grab despite the fact gaming remains a rather well priced hobby over the years.

    It’s not a fault of gamers to not see the bigger pictures, they rarely do. And yes, MS could have marketed the system a lot better than they did but to give in and U-turn rather than tweaking the system was a mistake.

    #15 11 months ago
  16. polygem

    “I really believe that someday, some company will look at what Microsoft tried to do and use it as a guide of what not to do, but to still broker a better deal for everyone. ”

    s t e a m b o x ?

    #16 11 months ago
  17. VibraniumSpork

    “I personally believe that Microsoft’s communication of what it was trying to achieve in its online policies was poor at best” – I keep on banging on about it on these posts (sorry y’all) but this, for me, is where Micrsoft really came undone. Some of their ideas had legs, but they were always going to be volatile issues for the gaming community. As such their communication and delivery needed a light touch…instead everyone got a full metal gauntlet to the face. It’s one of the worst marketing approaches I’ve ever, ever seen from a major company.

    And MS’s retort came in the form of constant backtracking, which has – in my opinion – made them look weak, feeble and sycophantic (towards the gaming crowd). You could barely fit a Rizla between the PS4 and XB1 as things stand now but all the same I can’t bear the thought of Microsoft at the moment. They’re that brown-nosing kid in class who’s always trying way too hard to be your friend…it’s not a good look and they need to lose it asap.

    #17 11 months ago
  18. JavelinX

    @14 Well I read it like “Dreamcast had this but because of slow internet it didn’t succeded” so “Microsoft could have DRM always-online (which IMO it isn’t a good thing like broadband was for the DC) but the market isn’t ready just like with the DC back then” It’s a fault comparison IMO. I love my DC :D

    #18 11 months ago
  19. polygem

    @viral: i really think they´re u-turning now and will take the time tweaking the system. but they´re to blame for that too. they just were too aggressive. if they would have tried a softer and smoother (and fairer!) transition to their new biz model everything would have been great. but they putted everything on one card with the goal to dictate the future of the digital business. thank heavens that failed. now we´ll see some much better solutions soon, for now they had to u-turn.

    #19 11 months ago
  20. manamana

    Great piece, Dave and I agree with Old McD. Though I believe the only company who can get it right in the future, would be Valve. Who knows what the Steambox might be but when it hits, it could swirl up a lot of dust.

    #20 11 months ago
  21. MCTJim

    I was fine with everything except for the 24 hr check..that could have been extended. I am glad they listened to a point, but they gutted what I thought were great features..especially the family sharing.

    #21 11 months ago
  22. polygem

    @20: oh man I SOOOO HOPE FOR THIS TO BE HAPPENING!

    seriously, sick of ms AND sony atm.

    i have a ps4 on preorder but i´d gladly change plans if someone leads me into the digital gaming future with some fair deals.

    #22 11 months ago
  23. Dave Cook

    @16 That’s what I’m thinking.

    @17 Agreed mate, some of the ideas *can* work if applied correctly, but they dropped the ball massively.

    @18 still such a great console :D

    @20 I think Valve could do it properly yeah

    @21 I never fully understood why 24 checks were needed. It was never properly explained.

    #23 11 months ago
  24. backup

    yes MS is wrong as always
    PC gamers are pirates
    xbot and pc gaming is dead

    #24 11 months ago
  25. Dave Cook

    @24 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJXR280wbEg

    #25 11 months ago
  26. JavelinX

    @24 Pc Gaming is Undead

    #26 11 months ago
  27. super3001

    ms were 100% right first time with xone.

    whining assholes who would not buy xone anyway forced change for worse. idiots scared that ms nailed digital future and shitty sony were stuck in last gen. they still are with ps3.5 which is a backward low tech worthless piece of shit.

    ms should not have listened to idiot whine

    #27 11 months ago
  28. backup

    @25
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJXR280wbEg

    #28 11 months ago
  29. backup

    @26

    Undead Nightmare

    #29 11 months ago
  30. MCTJim

    @23 24 hr DRM checks were not fully explained, but the family sharing may have been the root of it..so instead of you lending it to your buddy who lives in North Dakota for example, the system could check to make sure it was not loaned to another person on your list who lives in Spain…that would be the reason for the 24hr check..so no 2 people on your F/L could share it at the same time..kinda like lending the physical disc to only one person at a time.

    #30 11 months ago
  31. DrDamn

    @Dave
    “The one ‘good’ feature they should have kept was family sharing. I see no decent explanation as to why that feature had to be chopped following the first u-turn. It makes absolutely no sense to me.”

    Well either they had no faith in being able to communicate things and so went for the simplest option of things are as they are, or it wasn’t something they had fully worked through/agreed with publishers and they need time to work it through.

    @17
    “made them look weak”

    This. It’s almost like it was the first time anyone had questioned the approach – and they should have been doing that internally throughout the process. They needed clear responses to any questions people might ask. The complete and absolute reversal rather than trying to adapt the vision was bad too.

    #31 11 months ago
  32. Lengendaryboss

    @26
    Don’t counter-troll the troll.

    #32 11 months ago
  33. JavelinX

    IMO DRM is deeply NERD. It makes the industry more closed than ever. You have to be a coregamer to know what games and when these games will be released or to know when the next Steam massive discount party will be. IF they want more money they NEED to appeal to the masses. Without creating strong and restrictive boundaries.

    DRM is simply unappealing and unpractical

    #33 11 months ago
  34. Dave Cook

    @30 very interesting angle on it, I hadn’t considered that but it makes sense to track who has what games. Kudos :)

    #34 11 months ago
  35. Lengendaryboss

    Great Backup and Super lead the troll revolution.

    #35 11 months ago
  36. backup

    @32

    but u already counter

    #36 11 months ago
  37. viralshag

    @poly, What was aggressive and unfair about it other than the 24 hour check in?

    Steam is a form of DRM albeit a “nice” DRM that gamers don’t mind. X1 was a console with DRM. How on earth is a Steambox going to be anything other than another console with some form of DRM that will – as it’s Steam – most likely need to be connected to the net?

    #37 11 months ago
  38. DrDamn

    @30
    Nah. 24 hour check was to see if you had traded it in yet or not. They were still allowing trade-ins.

    #38 11 months ago
  39. MCTJim

    @34 that is how I understood it from my standpoint..I hope they bring it back.

    @30 yes they allowed trade ins with their new system in place. That was explained. BUT, it was to make sure once the disc was traded you no longer could use it…just like before..you dont have the game, you cant play it anymore.

    I think it was for both really

    Edit: @38..i misread your quote..sry, I just reaffrimed what you said…

    #39 11 months ago
  40. Sylrissa

    No Microsoft weren’t wrong in my opinion, it’s the only reason I haven’t written off the console entirely and will be picking one up as well as my PS4 when I can afford it.

    If they hadn’t reversed those decisions I would never be buying it full stop.

    #40 11 months ago
  41. Lengendaryboss

    @36
    Troll why u no make sense? why u no get lost?

    #41 11 months ago
  42. Dragon246

    @Dave,
    You are asking “us” if “we” were “right”? I think you know the answer “we” will give :D

    #42 11 months ago
  43. backup

    @35

    But u r legendary troll revolution.

    #43 11 months ago
  44. backup

    @32
    @35
    @41

    wat an example set by u Lengendaryboss troll
    JavelinX take notes of it

    #44 11 months ago
  45. Lengendaryboss

    @43/44
    Fail ban this troll.

    #45 11 months ago
  46. backup

    @45
    butt hurt much

    #46 11 months ago
  47. polygem

    @37: again :)
    pricing, simple as that. there´s an xbl sub to be paid (not on steam), they even have ads on that paid service (insane if you ask me), the games on demand pricing vs. steam pricing, the indies and arcade pricing on live vs steam, the steam sales…
    it is a very different beast and so much easier to swallow restrictions on steam because everything on the steamside of things screams: you get great value in return, while on xboxside it screams: restricitions but pay even more please…and yeah, swallow those ads too while your at it and yeah then we like to sell you this always on camera to help our advertisers to place some better ads for you. now say thanks please and hand over your money.
    they´ve been aggressive because they tried to get away with bringing all these restrictions without delivering any real benefits for the consumer. they also have been completely out of touch (at least to me) with their tv and sports presentation, the forced kinect…just tons of stuff i hated about it. i am a xbox gamer and a halo guy. I WANTED to buy the nextbox. i had my money on the bank for it already, just waited for the shot at the starting line. I WANT to go all digital as soon as i can still. if they cannot convince me as a long time xbox user. who are they trying to win over?

    #47 11 months ago
  48. VibraniumSpork

    @31 “It’s almost like it was the first time anyone had questioned the approach – and they should have been doing that internally throughout the process. They needed clear responses to any questions people might ask.”

    Word. This is surely considered the basic starting point before launching any kind of new product or feature – anticipate your audience’s misgivings and preemptively counter them with clear, concise communication. That a company as big and as experienced as Microsoft should fumble this still has me shaking my head in disbelief. Then again, I work for a fairly large corporation and similar oversights occur almost on the daily ^_^

    #48 11 months ago
  49. dizzygear

    “Basically, Microsoft said, ‘We’re going to be Steam.”

    Can we please stop comparing it to Steam? Steam took away allot of the annoyances of PC gaming and added a shitload of features for free in exchange for the DRM Steam games have.

    Also PC games long stopped having used games even before Steam with the CD keys and what not.

    The Xbone only took away stuff from consumers in exchange for absolutely nothing. There is no comparison.

    #49 11 months ago
  50. polygem

    #49+1

    #50 11 months ago
  51. DrDamn

    @MCTJim
    Family sharing doesn’t care whether the person who owns the game is playing it though, just that they own it. So the 24 hour check is an ownership check not a family share check.

    Anyone borrowing via the family share thing needed to do hourly checks – that was to keep updated their “lock” on the share. So it was the borrowers hourly check which determined if anyone else could borrow it, not the 24 hour check – that was just to enable the share in the first place :)

    #51 11 months ago
  52. viralshag

    @49, Why should we stop comparing it to Steam when essentially they were trying to do for console gaming what Steam did for PC gaming years ago?

    #52 11 months ago
  53. super3001

    ms communication is shit. always has been

    people been stupid thou. the sort that listen to specs and e3 know benefits outway restriction and digital is only way forward.

    getting ms to reverse was sabotage becose they knew sony had nothing next gen at all and ms had a forward facing machine.

    is cool to hate on ms. that is ONLY reason for public whining

    #53 11 months ago
  54. _LarZen_

    I would have preferred MS did not change their plans as I think it was a good plan for the future.

    #54 11 months ago
  55. JonFE

    It’s easy to see that the biggest error on Microsoft’s proposal was the lack of proper communication. They weren’t prepared for the public backslash (did they even considered such a thing?) and left a lot of questions unanswered / unexplained, so people filled in the blanks by assuming the worst case scenarios.

    For instance, the 24 hour online check was necessary to validate the game licenses, as no disk would be needed after installation, remember? How else can anyone guarantee that you won’t fill up a console with games, sell it on for a profit instructing the buyer not to connect it to the net ever again and continue playing the same games on another console?

    Also, they didn’t address the concern that games should be playable / authenticated for a long time after the Xbone would cease to exist in production. We took for granted Valve’s promise that they would patch their games not to require authentication if necessary, but does that promise include other publishers’ games? Is it even feasible? We won’t question them, but we did question Microsoft. Why? Do Steam sales daze us that much?

    #55 11 months ago
  56. mistermogul

    Yeah they should have continued with their own policies.

    By the time of the U-turn they had already lost my sale for trying to force that crap onto me in the first place.

    It shouldn’t have happened at all…

    #56 11 months ago
  57. noamlol2

    all that microsoft said was lies

    they WILL want you to sign their EULA and probably in there, there is a sentence that says you agree if they were any changes to the policy

    also remember that microsoft said the X1 will be region free? well what about the 360? my imported NA copy of NBA homecourt refuses to read due to it’s different region

    and microsoft said they’re going region free… what horse

    please if any guys have some sense here, DO NOT believe microsoft
    just look at windows 8, i can’t tell if it was meant to old people or rich people, cause it sucks for both

    #57 11 months ago
  58. Logion

    Even if they were wrong they did a horrible job listening to anyone.

    #58 11 months ago
  59. actuallyisnotafox

    in all honesty, the state that console gaming is in now, were developers are barely surviving and tablets and mobiles seem to be the best place to be. the whole original plan like drm and no used games would of made it worse. think about the families, the non gamers that buy consoles, they would walk into it expecting they can play any game, but these restrictions… i dunno im glad theyre gone, just to me i think they would of made things much worse and lowered what console buyers there are left.

    #59 11 months ago
  60. OrbitMonkey

    No they shouldn’t have listened.

    They should have kept their heads stuck firmly up their own arse’s & suffered a console launch that’d make the WiiU feel sorry for them.

    Now I have to listen to all this shit about how it would have been so good, blah blah.

    They sound like some bitter ex ranting on Facebook :/

    #60 11 months ago
  61. sebastien rivas

    I don’t mind Microsoft being Steam.
    But again with Steam you effectively have DRM but you Download the game to your platform and then with Steam you have the opportunity to play OFFLINE .

    So ok Microsoft be Steam all the way but what about Xboxlive, do I still need to pay to reach games I just purchased? again if it is not the case then it is called renting a game.

    And also be Steam does not mean 24 hour check on what you do on your console. I can leave my Steam offline and play game as long as I want. Again I am against the idea to send data for a what is supposed to be an Offline game, period!

    All this to say I don’t think Microsoft wants to be Steam. I think Microsoft wants Steam’s fame for free with Microsoft gaming process and I say no to that until Microsoft comes on the forefront and tell us precisely what they intend to be and do.
    if no 24 hours check+ no need for xboxlive subscription to reach out for purchased games and play themn offline then Microsoft and I are on a good start, the rest of technical need to be heard…

    #61 11 months ago
  62. G1GAHURTZ

    24 hr check and 1 hr check caused the uproar.

    As #55 says, 24 hr check was to stop multiple game installs from a single copy. Once that went, 1 hr check also had to go, meaning no family sharing, as 1 hr check was the security measure in place for that. They’ve indicated that they may have another solution to bring FS back in the future, but I can see why staying as far away from any sort of checks, whatsoever, was their immediate goal.

    Yep. No way companies should listen to raging trolls and fanboys.

    I do agree that communication was, and still is to a certain extent, their biggest problem, though.

    Maybe they should have gone with a 2 SKU, online/offline system, like some had predicted…

    #62 11 months ago
  63. Rockin a Jack D

    someone, somewhere will take what Microsoft set out to do with Xbox One and make it better, fairer, more practical and on terms that benefit most parties.

    SteamBox

    To quote Gabe Newell when asked: Do you think you can really disrupt the home entertainment space and compete with Microsoft and Sony?

    The internet is super smart. If you do something that is cool, that’s actually worth people’s time, then they’ll adopt it. If you do something that’s not cool and sucks, you can spend as many marketing dollars as you want, [they] just won’t.

    Change is coming and it won’t be from Sony, MS or Nintendo.

    #63 11 months ago
  64. JonFE

    @sebastien rivas:

    No, you would not need to pay for Xbox Live to play your offline games and they never said otherwise. You don’t need a subscription to access Xbox Live you know, there’s a thing called silver membership which is free.

    #64 11 months ago
  65. loci

    Bought hacks being used by Microsoft to soften people up for when the inevitable policy change reverts back.

    #65 11 months ago
  66. gamereck36

    I feel that ultimately the customer purchasing power forced MS hands in this situation.

    #66 11 months ago
  67. JonFE

    @Rockin a Jack D:

    Do you think that SteamBox -if it does get released- will not connect regularly to the internet to check games licenses?

    #67 11 months ago
  68. sebastien rivas

    @ 62

    Humm ok I understand what you say to “@55″
    Something more passive can be done without the use of 24 hrs check, if you know the game has a serial and the game has to be installed on a hdd to send copyrights data to microsoft heyy I am game XOXO code 1234 “I am first time installation”, all good to go? and then collect updates from the cloud then why do you need the dam 24 hrs check anyway?

    All in all and just the same thing I said yesterday and a similar article is that Enough is Enough with checking on meand what I play and how I play it.
    What’s next, “again just as yesterday”, should I send my SSN to prove I am me using the console I purchased and playing the game I purchased?

    I can see something coming like “You cannot play the game you lost 1 1/5 pound since last use, hold where you are a police officer is dispatching to you.
    That’s enough… seriously.
    I am a consumer not a thief.

    #68 11 months ago
  69. JonFE

    @68:

    Something had to be given, to allow trading used games. We cannot have our cake and eat it too. MS wanted to give us the option to trade our games (via another vague and unexplained procedure, may I add) which meant that there should be a way to check if the license was still valid.

    #69 11 months ago
  70. Rockin a Jack D

    @67

    That’s not the point. The point is there will be hardware released by someone that’ll change everything and be digital only.

    The Steambox is one candidate to do this. Along with what ever Google/Apple may release in the future.

    #70 11 months ago
  71. sebastien rivas

    @ 69

    Ha yes the EA phylosophy, thanks a bunch I completely forgot that one too. I 100% completely agree with you.

    On top of it something must be said to make it clear about that point.

    Games are 60 to 70$ nowadays. I am a dad with a wife, kiddo, a cat, a house with a mortgage and pay for my kiddo school.
    Although we are mid income, Do not expect me to buy new games all year around, it is physically impossible. I most of the time wait as long as it needs to be to purchase a game under 30$ mark whether new or used.

    Take off the trading market is like taking off a substantial point why I should buy the console in first place!

    #71 11 months ago
  72. JonFE

    @70:

    Totally agree on that point. Surely someone will do it better and succeed.

    I was just wondering if they’ll be able to do it without some of the restrictions people objected to.

    #72 11 months ago
  73. Eregol

    It doesn’t strike me as incredibly forward thinking to launch a machine to embrace a digital future with a 500GB HDD that isn’t replaceable.
    yes you can plug an external HDD into it, but that then takes up a USB port, and does away with the whole ‘One box’ thing they were trying to get everyone to buy into.

    #73 11 months ago
  74. Rockin a Jack D

    @72

    Well, Steam has an offline mode. So such a system could work the same way. Or do an online check every 24hrs, etc.

    Honestly though, consumers that buy these devices will be connected to the net constantly anyway, like myself for example. Therefore, the issue of being “connected” isn’t a problem.

    The only people that are concerned with restrictions are mostly console gamers. i.e. no secondhand sales, digital only games, etc.

    For PC gamers or consumers that only buy games on iTunes, Google Play, digital isn’t a problem.

    The X1 was a PR disaster for MS regarding digital. Things would’ve been different if they said: We’re going to release all our games digitally at £20 each, we’re going to hold sales regularly and you can share your library with your family. If that was the case then very few gamers would have cared about their retail disc.

    #74 11 months ago
  75. OrbitMonkey

    Their was no need for 24hr check in’s away. Microsoft are just pissed off about the backlash & have decided to take away family sharing as a “fuck you”.

    How hard would it really be to keep family sharing for digital downloads?

    Each game is coded or some such to register if it’s on someone else’s console.

    I mean that’s not bad right? But no, Microsoft are spitting their dummy, because their corporate vision sucks donkey cock.

    #75 11 months ago
  76. Ireland Michael

    No.

    #76 11 months ago
  77. Eregol

    @75 ‘How hard would it really be to keep family sharing for digital downloads?’

    That’s if the family sharing worked as rumours claimed it would. MS never fleshed out the details of it.
    I wonder if MS removed these features as they knew they weren’t as good as the Xbox faithful built them up in their heads to be?

    #77 11 months ago
  78. sebastien rivas

    Beside DRM another issue that arose but never went on is the NSA Prism disussion whereas I still do not know if Microsoft continue or not to go with .gov on chasing witches via data collection or not?

    That is another point that throw me away from Xbox 1. I don’t mind finding way to stop or derail dopyright infrigement but when I am the middle of it and someone collect stuffs on me without me knowing and I do not know what it is about then yes again it throws me off!
    If someone knows, please let us know.

    Cheer :)

    #78 11 months ago
  79. Cobra951

    Dave, if these people are so smart, why do they fail to see the very simple, very easily understood sticking points of the original XBO policies? The opposition was to the anti-consumer, overreaching DRM. A product which you buy should not demand constant authentication from you in order to work properly. That intrusion has *never* been endemic to game consoles during their entire long history.

    There is nothing wrong with digital distribution. I accept it, welcome it even, as long as it represents an improvement in convenience and cost. The current Xbox 360 does it exactly right. You can buy games digitally, and you do not need to be online once you’ve acquired them. You never need to allow Microsoft to inspect your games or your system in order to keep playing. You can also buy games on disc. The same games are often released in both formats, allowing for complete consumer choice.

    I’m sorry, but I stick to my original comment that these people are surprisingly mentally challenged when it comes to analyzing what happened between Microsoft and its prospective customers. They are focusing on entirely the wrong thing.

    So once again, slowly so they understand me:

    Digital . . . GOOD!

    Intrusive DRM . . . BAD!

    #79 11 months ago
  80. MCTJim

    @78 if you are given a court order you have to comply do you not? MS has clearly stated that they will not comply with what if they feel it is not justified

    The NSA is not spying on you playing video games..then those that worry should be more concerned posting to facebook, using their phone etc..Do I like the NSA/Prism and its program..HELL NO!! Do you think Sony wont comply if given an order? They have to also… If you are not a terrorist or not maligned with such organizations..then you are fine and worry too much.

    #80 11 months ago
  81. G1GAHURTZ

    @68:

    The system was that you could install an entire library of games onto your console, then never need to use a single disc that you used to install them, again.

    For example, my console is online. I have 10 games, and install them all.

    Once I’ve installed them, I no longer need the discs, so I give them to you.

    If you have no Internet, and your console is permanently offline, you can install every single one of those games, too.

    You can also play them as much as you like, and also give them to another friend.

    This can go on for millions of consoles, all from the same 10 games that I bought.

    An even more practical example is simply that of used games. I could trade in a game, but still have it on my console, as long as I stay offline.

    There is no way to check if it’s the first or 100th install, if the console never uses the internet. People could possibly even get a game, then uninstall and reinstall just to go online.

    That’s why we’ve lost the disc free gaming, and I’m now stuck having to swap discs, like it was 1994, unless I buy by direct download.

    Which is a clear loss of an amazing console feature that, again, no other console was looking to offer.

    #81 11 months ago
  82. sebastien rivas

    @ 80

    Thanks a bunch MCTJim. I never knew Microsoft stand and position in that matter.

    I would not say I worry too much but I definitely care for my privacy, especially if uneeded and unknown check occur.

    As a citizen, I must say NSA/Prism is a clear breach to rights of privacy. I wanted to make sure where Microsoft stands in that matter.

    Thanks again to make things clear and help Microsoft regain a sense of buying option in my heart!

    Cheer :)

    #82 11 months ago
  83. monkeygourmet

    @81

    Even at the smallest disc size a Xbone game would prob weigh in at 25gig…

    If it’s 500gig HD, thats only 20 games… Not really a library…

    #83 11 months ago
  84. MCTJim

    @82 its more or less overhyped in relation to the NSA and Prism with the X1. They wont be looking at you in your living room. I still don’t like the NSA or Prism..and if they(the NSA) are reading this, bite me :P

    @83 then you can buy a external drive at 1-2tb for 125 bucks at your local store..you can indeed use any external HDD

    #84 11 months ago
  85. G1GAHURTZ

    ^ Exactly.

    X1 allows you to install to external HDDs.

    http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/21/xbox-one-hard-drive/

    #85 11 months ago
  86. Kreion

    @82

    As a citizen you have no right to privacy, keep that in mind.

    @83

    Since you can save to external HDD’s you can have any amount of games stored, so yes you can have a library. The bigger the HDD on the X1 the slower it’d be, and having an SSD would just jack up the price stupid amounts.

    #86 11 months ago
  87. MCTJim

    @86 the bigger the slower? how do you figure that? Since the HDD is indexed the speed should be no slower than the one inside the X1.

    #87 11 months ago
  88. sebastien rivas

    @ 81

    First and foremost I must apology. Because I truly want an Xbox next gen and this all Xbox features goes against me that it is a deep wrench just so to my heart so I act like ticking time bomb.

    A policy to refrain or even completely stop misuse of copyright. I say yes go all the way with it because I know it is extremely tedious for AAA companies to produce games nowadays and still make profit on it.

    A policy to check on me every so often without me knowing is just against my will to be and live free.

    Go like Steam, hell yes. Go like Steam, login, purchase, download, enjoy.
    But go like steam login, purchase, download, enjoy and still getting checked every 24 hours, no way.
    Why not Go like steam, login with passive console system definition such as xbox 1 manufactur XOXOXO-Beta 3-12345, purchase, download, enjoy the game only on that console whether Offline or Online.My console have the right to be unique with microsoft definition so why not.
    And to go even further to help the game industry is this:
    I go to my friend, I login my name with passive microsoft definition, get a clear message from Microsoft saying “this is not your machine you can still download and enjoy the game for 7 days then the owner of machine XBXBXB-Alpha 2-12345 can purchase the game via our cloud”, download the game, enjoy the game. Do this exclusive try out for 5 machines and EVERYONE is happy. The gamer, the game industry, the game console manufacturer.

    I just don’t want to be checked every day if I am me and I use a console I purchased and a game I purchased.
    I am not a thief, I am a consumer

    #88 11 months ago
  89. super3001

    glad at least a few other posters understand (giga, mtcjim, etc)

    majority of vg247 posters are thick as pig shit

    #89 11 months ago
  90. MCTJim

    I am still hoping they bring back family sharing..I am going to be downloading all my games anyways. Hopefully they offer me a discount..for digital, which I doubt, but hey I can wish for it :D

    #90 11 months ago
  91. OlderGamer

    No, they weren’t.

    Now if they would just do something about that damn Kinect requirement I might actually want one.

    #91 11 months ago
  92. G1GAHURTZ

    @88:

    Maybe I wasn’t clear enough before… Sorry if that’s the case.

    I’ll try again…

    If I have an Xbox One, and I never connect to the internet, the console cannot check anything.

    BluRay discs used for games are read only. So there is no way that the console can ever check if a game has been installed before.

    To put it simply: Offline consoles play any games. It is impossible to make them block any games after they leave the factory.

    Impossible.

    That means that once someone installs a game from a disc, they can install the same copy of the same game on an unlimited number of offline consoles.

    One sale. Unlimited number of people playing it.

    The only way to stop that happening (and stop devs going out of business) is with online checks, or by making sure that the disc is required.

    Nobody is saying that you or anyone else is a thief.

    #92 11 months ago
  93. bradk825

    There are arguments to be made that something needs to be done for publishers to capture revenue from their game’s sales in a more effective way, but the planned version of DRM wasn’t the way to do it.

    You can see what the idea behind it was: Go half-way to digital to get people used to not having a disc, then, next-next gen, take the disc away.

    But it was poorly designed and even more poorly communicated.

    #93 11 months ago
  94. DrDamn

    @92
    I think they confused the issue by trying to make discs the same as digital. Should have just said retail discs work as they do now – we will require you to install to HDD, but to play you need to put the discs in. Digital has a load of extra cool features though, no disc swapping, family sharing, access to your library on other machines if logged in. Entice to become digital.

    #94 11 months ago
  95. bradk825

    @94 that is EXACTLY the model they should have gone with.

    #95 11 months ago
  96. fearmonkey

    I actually wish in some ways that MS stuck to their guns, only because they could have been completely and truly trounced by Sony for their stupid decisions. Yeah sticking to their guns would have been the thing to do…lol.

    I have said I love Xbox and I still do, but MS ruined my attitude toward their brand overall. MS does what MS always does, they choose a direction and don’t care what anyone thinks, they believe that in the end, everyone will come to them anyway because MS got away with it with the Office Ribbon (I work in IT and I can tell you people still complain to me about it), but failed to really get consumer interest in Windows 8 because of the start button fiasco. Windows 8 sold in spite of MS, because it was cheap at first if you already had Windows 7 or bought a new PC, but 90 percent of people (that I know or work with) that have it prefer Windows 7. Those that do like Windows 8 modified it to have the start button. It was an operating system before its time, fixing a problem we didnt have yet. Touch screen monitors on desktops arent all that common yet, and might not ever be.

    MS only stopped with these heavy handed rules because they saw the writing on the wall, and knew Sony was going to get such a mega head start that they might never catch up. They had to give in, and i bet they cried many tears over it. I find it hard to support them, and I will wait on an Xbone because of it.

    Cliffy and others who disagree, well good for them, they can cry and shout out all the want, but the simple fact is that the BULK of the people that love console gaming didn’t want what they were pushing. Cliffy can bemoan and whine and knash his teeth, but who really cares.

    Seriously, Xbone is a better console because of Sony, and Xbox fans should thank Sony for not going the same direction. I know there are holdouts here that seem to think MS’s heavy handed system was the way, but you always have that. If someone made a gaming controller that shocked you painfully every time you die in a game for “Realism”, and they wised up and cancelled it, people out their would bemoan what a loss that is, and today’s gamers just aren’t hardcore enough.

    #96 11 months ago
  97. Eregol

    I think the biggest issues that came as a result of the online checks were that you could only check into games bought from the country you were checking into, essentially region locking every game you buy. So, if you were a serving soldier stationed overseas you couldn’t play a game your girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/husband/significant other bought you as you weren’t in the purchasing country to register it to your account.
    Also, if you happen to be located somewhere without internet for more than 24 hours then you might as well not bother taking your console as you wouldn’t be able to play it.

    When I moved house I was without internet for over a month. If I had had an Xbox One I wouldn’t have been able to do any home based console gaming. I’m not the only person to ever experience this, and many people will experience this many times.

    #97 11 months ago
  98. sebastien rivas

    @ 89

    It is not about thick as pig shit it is about how you want to live your life.
    My privacy count in all of this and I feel hurt when I am not trusted for something I purchase.

    On second hand it is about how this cloud works. if I pay for an offline game but still have to login somehow to a monthly paying sub then no way. It is called renting not owning.

    Thick pig shit may be., but thick pig shit who thinks surely.

    Something my mom told me early in age: There is the art, and there is the manner. Having both makes who you are .
    DRM as it is right now with the 24 hours check makes me understand there is no art and there is no manner in Xbox1 as a feature but a lynching at consumers and buyers. I won’t be whipped, I tell you that much.

    #98 11 months ago
  99. G1GAHURTZ

    @94:

    Yeah, with hindsight, I agree there.

    I can see what they might have been thinking, though. Some people are limited by download limits and low speeds, so they probably just wanted to give people the option of using the disc as a replacement method of getting the same features.

    It’d probably also be confusing, for some people, being able to share some of their games, but not others.

    #99 11 months ago
  100. sebastien rivas

    @ 96

    Man, you made my day how you cracked me up If someone made a gaming controller that shocked you painfully every time you die in a game for “Realism”, and they wised up and cancelled it, people out their would bemoan what a loss that is, and today’s gamers just aren’t hardcore enough

    #100 11 months ago
  101. fearmonkey

    @100 – Lol glad you liked that, it’s only funny because it’s true. :)

    #101 11 months ago
  102. sebastien rivas

    @ 99

    It is true too.
    I have a 3 megs/sec here with multiple devices connected and I know I do never go above 310 kb/s.But I must say running my machine overnight is not uncommon because I DL from Steam to my PC once in awhile but it is a pain.

    #102 11 months ago
  103. lookingglass

    A democracy relies on the intelligence of its citizens. People who lack intelligence are prone to manipulation, overreaction, and fall more easily into group mentalities. They often make short-sighted, easy choices without regard for their long term well-being.

    Microsoft is not a democracy. They employ many of the smartest people in the world. For them to change policies is for them to trust the mindless mob more than they trust themselves.

    The mob cares for nothing but the mob. Each person within the mob is selfish and blends in to increase its chances of success just like a herd of animals.

    Most people think they consciously chose a side in the console debate, when really they just wanted to pick the winner. They joined the herd unknowingly to protect themselves from losing. The brain is an interesting thing, but we are still animals.

    The gaming community is an embarrassing example of group dynamics. I hope its actions doom the console entirely.

    #103 11 months ago
  104. polygem

    oh boy. this next gen starts terrible imo. i am totally unsure what to do. 360 was my main console before they introduced ads, now they came up with their strange customerunfair attititude. the ps3 was the flawed system (imo) and i am not having the fullest trust in sony either. i´d love to go nintendo exclusive but the wii u is made as a secondary console. steambox sounds promising but there are no real news regarding that thing.

    i want to be hyped. i want to buy into the next gen but man what a fucked up start this is.

    might really just stick with the ps3 and wait. really got hopes for the steambox now. sony and ms start to piss me off.

    #104 11 months ago
  105. sebastien rivas

    @ 103

    That is where we disapgree. I believe in people who think to make a democracy as long as debate occurs.
    each person posting here “mostly” talk for him/herself and not as if they were part of a brand or group whether you like DRM and what it stands for or you are against DRM and what it stands for.

    Your post is exactly in the image of DRM functionnality, just trying to shove something misconstrude down the user throat. If Microsoft relays on smartest people in the world then they should think again because I don’t say yes to everything and anything presented to me.

    Most if not all here “against DRM” are not against DRM (me included) but against what it stands for. Most would love the option of internet/cloud only use but that is not the only use of DRM. DRM is a check up on you every 24 hours without you knowing it. Now it just so happens I relate in many ways to some other poster that do not want to see DRM as it has been developped so far.

    Again I am a consumer, not a thief. But unfortunately DRM makes me feel Microsoft takes me for a thief so I have no choice but to fight against it so in the end I may still own an Xbox. If it it does not go through then too bad… maybe next gen.

    But you are right in some ways because the voice carries and the many more the stronger the voice is; therefore perhaps I am seen as a tool and part of an “anti DRM” bandboyz group but sincerely while it does not mean I am right, I know that because I think therefore I am so my voice and wallet carries on.

    #105 11 months ago
  106. JonFE

    @polygem:

    Well, that’s my plan: wait and see. I’m in no hurry to purchase a new console. I just got a WiiU for its -Nintendo- exclusives, that I’ve barely touched and my x360/ps3 backlog is already huge.

    #106 11 months ago
  107. polygem

    @106: maybe i should do exactly that. buy a wiiu again and wait what will happen.

    i sold my 360 already but still have 3ds, vita and ps3…lots of stuff to play on these systems.

    i liked the wiiu but traded it in because i just had waaay too many consoles but just not enough time.
    was stupid not to sell the 360 instead back then. i did that now anyway and don´t regret it.

    i miss the wiiu though. it´s a neat machine.

    it´s crap that you cannot use your old account anymore, that it´s stuck to the console. same with your purchases. that´s something that makes me hesitate picking one up again, that AND the pricedrop i smell.

    oh and miiverse too, i had no control anymore. addicting stuff. i drawed pictures on miiverse like a maniac. no time for that :)

    #107 11 months ago
  108. Belmont

    Microsoft didn’t directly listen to consumers, It painfully witnessed its main rival getting an immense head start and then decided to change course.

    Yet I believe that both Schell and Cliffy B have a point and what they say is logically correct, on the other hand though I don’t think that (poor communication and introduction aside ) the model Micrsoft had was a good one. I mean, at the price range the console games are usually offered on PSN/XBL, this model wasn’t going to work. It needed more tweaking.

    #108 11 months ago
  109. JB

    Schell is a symptom of the mindset in large parts of the videogame industry today. According to this view consumers are the problem.

    #109 11 months ago
  110. CraZed

    Did preorders of the XB1 pick up after the reversal? Yes. SO I would say they were completely right to listen to their consumers…. This idea that MS knew better than the very people who were buying a next gen console what they wanted is non-sense.
    Stop trying to compare the XB1 DRM scheme to Steam it was nothing like it and the ability to resell and/or trade physical media has no impact on any of the so-called added benefits of all digital.
    There is NO reason the whole family sharing stuff can’t be there for the digital side and in fact if put in place would most likely drive digital sales above physical thereby serving the ends of Microsoft and those developers looking to kill off used game sales etc.
    Consumers know what they want and they didn’t want what MS was dealing up. There was no announced price drop for digital titles, no guarantee of continued support beyond the consoles lifecycle, and the worst part IMHO was they were going to allow the used sales through “authorized retailers” of which you KNOW Gamestop would have been one. Cutting out the sale between private parties and setting up a showdown in the courts over first sale rights etc.
    No, MS was not wrong to listen to the consumer. They were wrong for trying this in the first place.

    #110 11 months ago
  111. MrWaffles

    People keep forgetting to mention the issue of games bought online (with steam as drm) VS games on disc that still ask you (before the backtrack) to check online as if it was a piece of code on the cloud.

    Gamers were pissed because Microsoft was trying to ALSO control how players used, shared and sold their discs.

    Dave, how can you talk about this issue without mentioning the disc-cloud-drm is beyond me.

    -Waffles

    #111 11 months ago
  112. MrWaffles

    @110 spot-on mate.

    Had Microsoft announced a lower digital price point (with 24h check) people would’ve take it. That is, IF they hadn’t also tried to fuck with physical games.

    Gamers tolerate steam because the prices are LOW, you can’t sell your games, but who cares when it was only like $30 or less?

    Microsoft is still thinking “shit, why wouldn’t they want to buy drm-ridden games online for $70?? Silly gamers.

    #112 11 months ago
  113. monkeygourmet

    @84, 85

    That I did not know.

    Good move.

    #113 11 months ago
  114. fearmonkey

    @103 – “Microsoft is not a democracy. They employ many of the smartest people in the world. For them to change policies is for them to trust the mindless mob more than they trust themselves.”

    That mindless mob are what we call “customers”, and the way it works is that those customers buy a product that they have interest in. If MS does something that causes lack of interest from it’s customers, then it really has no business, no profit, and no long term survival.

    MS is huge you say, but they are beholden to their shareholders and will cut their losses if big enough. They can’t stubbornly say we know the best and stay in that market if no one buys it (see Zune as an example)

    Cry a river on MS not giving you all the DRM you can eat, the rest of us are happy, We of the mindless mob, the bulk of consumers, have more money than the few of you that want that crap.

    #114 11 months ago
  115. DuckOfDestiny

    There’s a difference between innovating and taking a massive shit over something that already works perfectly fine.

    #115 11 months ago
  116. Christopher Jack

    In my opinion the damage was already done. They failed to promote the one & only good feature of their restrictive regime, ‘family’ sharing(though I am doubtful it would have been as great as their fans screamed) then they pissed the few that actually tolerated it by removing that feature along with DRM.

    Frankly I’d like to see all next gen games come with a little code in the case to OPTIONALLY install AND remove a game to your account. I say optionally because I’ve always seen the ability of shoving a disk into a console & being able to play it straight away as a major advantage over the typical installation bs we all go through on PC. I don’t see why not either, I mean both next gen consoles are using faster blu ray readers(worth noting that I believe Sony is using a faster one).

    #116 11 months ago
  117. ianbenoir

    I think the main flaw in microsoft was that it felt like it was more about “what we want from you” and “how to make this work” then “what you’ll get” while sony was all about “what you get” they didn’t even talked about things that may be a downside to the console.
    I mean, microsoft made the new console look like its something that you’ll have to read a manual, and changing their mind after everything just made things worse to understand.

    #117 11 months ago
  118. Reddpayn

    They had designed the console to be allways online and just in a sudden they changed the whole formula. So the console isnt as good or capable as ms had originally planned because of this flipping. And when every xbox fan talks about the amazing cloud functions and all which were somewhat introduced at e3 i think that they wont be as functional as they said like forza developers have said. So ms shouldnt have changed its whole idea of drm because eventually they are going to regret it and they will fix it by turning xbones to allways online consoles by system updates and that will be even bigger mess.

    #118 11 months ago
  119. Vice

    Their original approach was that of making money. Always online to stop piracy. No used games/fee for used games to maximize profits so developers were happier and released more exclusive games on their console, making it more and more popular.
    Naturally no sane player with even a little bit of brains would like that. I’m glad they had guts to change their policy. I might actually buy xbox now, even though I’m a PC gamer and hate everything console-ish. Consoles are for lazy stupid people who put their own comfort above a big chunk of extra content.

    #119 11 months ago
  120. backup

    PC gamers are pirates we get it

    #120 11 months ago