The Great Trophy Debate

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The Great Trophy Debate

(21 posts)

Started 4 months ago by Telepathic.Geometry
Latest reply from ruckus

Telepathic.Geometry
Member

I'm sure if I really looked hard there's a thread like this out there somewhere, so I beg your forgiveness if I'm throwing away valuable bytes. Anyway...

I really wanna know what everybody thinks about trophies and achievements. I'm sure everybody has an opinion on 'em, so whether you love them and can't imagine a gaming world without them - and for what it's worth, I can't - or you hate them, think they destroy the core element of gaming and should be killed with fire, let us know down below.

To get the ball rolling, I'll start. I'm the kind of gamer who would rather play a smaller number of great games thoroughly, than a flavour of the month gamer, who has a broader gaming library, but who just clears them, and then moves on (without needing to see NG+ or kill that hidden final FINAL boss) to the next thing...

So, let's hear it. How much of an arsehole am I for being a trophy whore? Is it here for keeps? Should we get rid of it? Did I in fact make this exact same thread in the past?

Posted 4 months ago #
polygem
Member

first, you're not an arsehole;) and yeah you made this thread in the past....it never gets old though.
i for one don't care abou trophies. only game i have all 'main game' achievments is halo reach and you know what? it doesn't even show as fully completed on my xbl account. why? because i bought dlc (with more achivements) before i finished the last 2 of the main game. to me this is a broken system. vita trophies didn't really show on my ps3, don't let me begin with the early ps3 games that don't even have trophies.
i also don't need lists of games my friends own/completed. why? to check if they are as cool as me? played all the great games? are hardcore like me or little cry babies with no gamerscore...i mean you trigger this attitude in the kids these days. maybe not in you and me because we're old farts but in the kids.
i think gaming should become more of something you can enjoy together, less competition and off showing. i am not fully blaming achievments for this, but they have their part in it i think.
they are just not for me. i don't need them, i don't want them, i don't care about them. i prefered the old days, when a game was just a game i can buy, play, love and embrace, finish, maybe replay, without going after something, just for the sake of enjoying a game. i mean sure, i can still do it today and i do but still it's kinda different. that's why i like the wiiu so much and i hope they wont add an achievement system one day. gaming is too much about competition, grinding and showing off already. this triggers something weird, especially in gamers. not in everybody though! i can see why some people love trophies and that's totally cool! wiiu is more about sharing stuff, experiences, helping out, making jokes about the game (in a good way). i prefer this take on online for sure.
i can see what people are playing atm but no track record of games they played one day. i think they kinda shot themselves in the foot with this too because some (i personally think quite a lot) people think like this: i played and completed the game, it's on my track record, let's sell it and buy another one (used).
i hope all this can be discussed without the usual fanboy calling. we'll see.

Posted 4 months ago #
grizzlycake
Member

It's nice I guess but for me it doesn't really add anything. I think ingame trophies that actually give you sweet things like funny costumes, extra vehicles, etc. are a lot cooler.

It's a shame that cheatcodes have almost all dissapeared because of them though.

Posted 4 months ago #
Deacon
Member

I think they're awful. Yet, I secretly really enjoy acquiring them. The 'completionist' in me loves hearing that ding, and feels proud when I finally achieve 100%.

However, I think it sucks the big one that a lot of people will ignore reason and stick with MS/Sony for next gen based solely on the fact that they don't want to lose their precious gamerscore. That's just idiotic. I for one am keeping a very open mind RE next gen. And while I'm proud that my 'level' is higher than most on my friends list (sort of proves your dedication, no?) I'm not afraid of jumping ship and starting at 0. I'd wager that others aren't going to be so flexible.

Also, there's the temptation to stick playing games that earns you these trophies. I have a Wii sitting at home, and I fucking love JRPG's. Therefore why haven't I picked up Xenoblade? The Last Story? That's right. I see the 100+ hours and think how many achievements I could be earning in that time playing PS3 games. That's fucking stupid right there, but I doubt that trail of thought is exclusive to myself.

I think we've talked about this before TG. I hold the utmost respect for anyone who can plat Demon's & Dark Souls. You're a bit of a hero let's face it.

I completely understand those who enjoy achievements. They're addictive. And they show your skill & dedication.

If the first thing you do when firing up a new game for the first time is to rush off to check the trophy list, then I think you're doing it wrong. Play the game through first - completely ignoring trophies, and then if you really enjoyed it, by all means go through again getting all the superfluous bits and bobs.

Buying shitty games just to rush through them and boost your gamerscore is certainly not cool in my eyes. That's the point when I think you have a problem.

Wonder if trophies/gamerscore will remain as-is next gen...

Posted 4 months ago #
Digital Bamboo
Member

I've commented on this before, so I'll keep this brief.

I hate trophies, don't mind if others like 'em, but personally I find the pop-up notificaitons annoying & distracting, and I don't give a shit about my % or score, I've never even looked at them.

It also drives me nuts that they CANNOT be muted, or pushed to the background. Utter bullshit.

The only thing worse than trophy notifications that I can imagine is the game pausing every 15 minutes for mandatory commercial breaks.

Maybe next gen?

Posted 4 months ago #
viralshag
Member

I love them but I'm not sure I would say I'm a cheevo whore. I like getting them but I won't spend time on a game just to get a certain achievement if I've actually finished it, unless it's something I really love like Mass Effect.

The thought of getting crap quick games to boost my score has crossed my mind but then I think "actually, I would rather not waste my time" and don't bother. I do love and think they should be in all MMOs though, I LOVE WoW and Rift achievements. A lot of them are fun, funny and random and not always just a simple grind.

On the flip side, it does annoy me that I have so many games on my profile with unachieved cheevos.

Posted 4 months ago #
livewired500
Member

I mostly ignore them. A lot of the time they are just stupid. Like one I saw that wanted me to shoot a guy in the foot while they were jumping. Really?

All this tacked on multiplayer in games today, they have a bunch of trophies tied to that now too. I don't like a lot of multiplayer games or some are fun to mess around a bit, but I don't want to spend dozens of hours on them to get a stupid trophy. The worst would be if the multiplayer didn't work like with Bulletstorm on the PS3.

I think I have one or two Platinum on PS3 out of 100+ games. Does 360 have Platinum or Gold? I don't know. Couldn't tell you my gamer score either. Steam achievements, if they are there, it's too many. Team Fortress 2 has 448. That's ridiculous. Civ 5, 227. Wow. The Binding of Isaac has 84!

So, yeah could care less if they are there or not. Do they trick some people into playing some games more than they really should? Yeah.

Posted 4 months ago #
OlderGamer
Moderator

I really don't like them either.

I am really enjoying the fact that WiiU doesn't have them.

On PS360, they are tolerable. Go play a few Steam games. Some of those games have way too many. To the point that they become meaningless because they blend together as one big sea of stupid.

And also, how many stupid ones are there. You are playing a racing games, congratulations!!! you just bought a car! Well yeah...duh. Or you are playing a OMP shooter, and you just killed your first player...isn't that the point? Just silly.

I have very few games(I think Halo, Civ Rev, and PSU) where I got 100% of the achivies. They just aren't for me.

Sorry Livewired, I didn't read your post till after this was written, didn't mean to copy you. But I feel the same way.

Posted 4 months ago #
Dragon246
Member

I also like trophies. I play everyday, but only 1-1.5 hours. I would like to get something out of my each session, trophies help me do that.
Plus, trophies are cool!
I view them something as Medal Of Honors. When I work on a good game to earn the platinum, it gets me very happy. That said, I know when I cant get one and quit (looking at you MK)
Although I am perfectly fine with people not liking trophies. I also don't have any problems with people Hannah Montana to get plat (I am thinking of doing so, but only when I have too much time). What I hate is people cheating and then showing off their levels. You cant get a plat in 4 minutes.

@Deacon,
"However, I think it sucks the big one that a lot of people will ignore reason and stick with MS/Sony for next gen based solely on the fact that they don't want to lose their precious gamerscore. That's just idiotic. I for one am keeping a very open mind RE next gen. "
I don't agree with that mate. Most people have preferences for everything, consoles aren't an exception to that rule.Besides, I really don't think people who are trophy/achievement hunters do it on a platform they hate. Its more about community. If you have friends and other things in a particular ecosystem, then unless the other cos offers are just too good wrt your current system, I don't se why people would jump ship. Trophies play a part, but a small one.
Btw, you wont stay ahead of me much longer :D .

Posted 4 months ago #
Telepathic.Geometry
Member

I think that the next natural evolution of trophies/cheevos will be to have a management system. You can turn them on/off when you set up your system on day one, and then within that, you should have the ability to delete achievements, have it so they don't pop mid-game and maybe have some privacy options...

Posted 4 months ago #
deathm00n
Member

I used to be a pirate, all my games in the PC and PS2 where pirated (games are too much expensive in my country to simple ask your fathers to buy it for you). The first time I've got a original game was in november of 2011 when I started working bought my PS3. When I had the pirated games I played all AAA games that were out in every month, not completing them, most of them I played one day and let it go. But now with original games I have to consider wich game I'll get, I buy only 1 per month (my salary isn't great), and with the trophies these games lasts way longer, hell, I still play Uncharted 3 after completing the story last year and I'm very far to the platinum. So for me trophies are very good, they extend my desire to keep playing the game, I know I could just say to myself: this game is fun, I will do everything there is to do in it. But the trophies are just satisfactory to get. I never use it to show off, I use it to help me enjoy the game as much as I can.

And think about this: what's the difference between the trophies and the good old high scores we had in SNES era? It was the same kind of show off.

Posted 4 months ago #
Deacon
Member

@ Dragon - yeah, I don't know. Next gen I'll be putting my Sony bias behind me and ignoring the shortcomings of Microsoft these last couple of years. I'd like to think that I'll make an informed decision based on whomever ends up offering more of what I like. That has always been Sony, but who knows what's going to happen.

Even I don't really like the idea of leaving my current profile behind and starting again, but I'll do it if MS end up offering 'the ultimate gamers machine'. Are the people who plat every game they touch and really enjoy the trophy system going to so easily forsake all that they have 'achieved'? I don't think so.

I'm not saying it's going to be 'the deciding factor', but it'll definitely be a factor for some.

@TG - yeah I think you're on the right track. They're certainly not going to remove them, so options to customize would seem logical. I'd like to see more incentive beside the trophy itself. Custom themes perhaps. Or a discount on the sequel ;) haha

Posted 4 months ago #
Dragon246
Member

@deathmoon,
Can relate to many of your experiences mate.

@Deacon,
I would look at it as a tie-breaker, which I think it would be for many people. I don't think sony and ms offering will have any ground breaking advantage over one another, so I can see people staying with the system they spent most time on. Not a bad thing imo.

Posted 4 months ago #
deathm00n
Member

Sorry to derail a little the topic, but Dragon, you own a PS3 right? After the last system update viewing trophys became a pain, having to sync everything everytime you want to see them, do you know if you can disable it? I have PS+, it's just dumb to make me sync my trophies since it does it for himself every night while I'm sleeping.

And by the way, AC3 will get me playing a lot, holy shit there's so many things to do and trophies to get

Posted 4 months ago #
Anonymous
Unregistered

I'm the same way T.G. although I care about trophies way more than I do achievements once I get a platinum or 100% I'm pretty much going on to the next game. No NG+ for me unless its necessary for a platinum. I don't care about the secret level boss or anything.

I just want to get that platinum asap but I still try to enjoy the game as much as possible. Story matters just as much to me.

Posted 4 months ago #
Anonymous
Unregistered

@ Deathmoon yes, go to trophies icon press triangle and set to offline mode. that way you can view your trophies without it syncing first to the servers every annoying time. When you want to sync just hit X on your user profile under friends list.

Posted 4 months ago #
Deacon
Member

^ nice one man. Didn't know you could do that! :p

Posted 4 months ago #
deathm00n
Member

@theelvilaires Thanks man, you aren't so evil as people out there are saying :)

Posted 4 months ago #
livewired500
Member

@OG Old minds think alike :)
I just think for older gamers, like myself, we played for so long without them, that they don't mean a whole lot. I don't dislike them, per se. I understand the appeal. To me though, they are mostly meaningless.

@deathm00n
"And think about this: what's the difference between the trophies and the good old high scores we had in SNES era? It was the same kind of show off."

For me, it was only showing off if you could post high-scores in the arcade. Actually, I think games like Stardust HD are cool because you post high-scores against your friends. Adds a little competitiveness to the game. Autolog in NFS:Hot Pursuit, trying to beat friend's times, that's fun.

But do I care that my buddy has a Plat in BioShock 2 where half the trophies are in multiplayer. No. The MP was fun for a little while and got old really quick. Same with games like RDR and Uncharted 2/3. I don't think I even tried the MP in Gears of War games.

Posted 4 months ago #
Clupula
Member

As someone who has been playing games since Colecovision, I love trophies. I was never the type of guy to try to collect every star in a Mario game or anything like that. It always seemed lame to me to do anything extra than try to just beat a game, because no one would ever know you did it.

Trophies were like someone had answered my exact problem. The first game I ever platinumed was the original Dead Space and I did so many things in that game I would have never done before trophies. Actually play the zero-g basketball? Play through the hardest difficulty with the weakest weapon? All of those things became goals with trophies in mind.

Now, mind you, I only try to platinum games I greatly enjoy or are humanly possible. I will never platinum Wipeout HD. I will never platinum Warhawk. I will never platinum Star Ocean: The Last Hope International. I'm fine with that. But I am one trophy away from platinuming Okami. I have to catch every fish in the game. When I got it on PS2, I did the fishing mini-game once and never looked at it again. Here, I've spent time getting better at it and taking the time to learn how to catch the bigger fish without breaking my line.

In the meantime, they're also great because they let you know what games your friends are playing and where they are in them. I've had many conversations with friends over, "Oh, how did you get ______?" Or "How many tries did it take you to beat so and so?" They greatly enhance games in my opinion.

Posted 4 months ago #
ruckus
Member

We all like different things from one extreme to another and as long as no one's getting hurt it's all good. Everyone knows this but it takes time to implement. Hence the flipping motherflipper Man has to lie about 'options'. I love options, and in games they are the 'live and let live' light of goodness but The Man says they is to complicated for us. They stop the consumption of games because 'the options' fry peoples minds in trying to understand them.

This bastard way of thinking has deprived humanity of so much: no ai difficulty slider in Grand Prix Legends. All racing games where you can't decide on what ai gets to race (like rFactor and MSR/PGR) etc. Not being able to sit down in chairs... oh sorry - these are pet hates of mine!

Anyhoo - same for achievements, same for anything. The one great thing about the virtual is that it can be anything to everyone but instead gets squished and prodded and turned in to tv. ;_;

Posted 4 months ago #

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