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Killzone: Shadow Fall can handle 24 AI enemies on screen before frame-rate drops

Wednesday, 16th October 2013 13:10 GMT By Dave Cook

Killzone: Shadow Fall developer Guerrilla Games has stated that the PS4 shooter can handle 24 AI troops on screen before the frame-rate drops. It’s currently pegged at 60FPS.

Speaking with OPM, lead designer Eric Boltjes said of the leap to PS4, “For me as a game designer what I was really interested in was getting more gameplay elements on screen. More enemy types at the same time, more weapon types. Bigger areas. For me that gives us a lot more ingredients to play around with. Previously we were limited. You could have six or seven guys on screen, only two types, and it had to be at a specific range”

When asked about the on-screen enemy limit, Boltjes replied, “Yes. It’s about 24,” and added, “but that’s just enemy AI. And there are other types of enemy AI, lots of destructibility, lots of dynamic objects. Those have much higher limits but the amount of AI is around 24″.

When asked what would happen if a 25th enemy were to come on screen, he replied, “framerate drops,” and continued, “They’re all autonomous, they create their own effects. They’re busy little bees.” He concluded, “as soon as you push it over [24] then we get performance issues”.

The game recently shown at an event in Russia, and some naughty bugger has leaked the footage. Check it out here.

What do you think of the tech-chatter above? Let us know below.

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51 Comments

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  1. gomersoul

    Holy shit there’s that f word again, dare I say 1080p?! Round 1… Fight!

    #1 6 months ago
  2. CyberMarco

    In before Erth and his “PS2-era textures, no light/shadow, 900p…” bullshit!

    #2 6 months ago
  3. VibraniumSpork

    @2 LOL :D

    24 enemies on-screen at once sounds impressive but then again…I’ve never counted how many enemies were on-screen at once in any other FPS. Apart from DOOM II; I distinctly remember that final ‘Hell-Portal’ level being positively awash with those fire-breathing ballsack dudes…

    #3 6 months ago
  4. Pytox

    @1 lol !

    CyberMarco , did he say something about KH3? :p

    #4 6 months ago
  5. monkeygourmet

    24?

    That’s a lot. Also explains the reason they had to reduce the quality of the models they used. They only used about 1/4 of the amount of detail compared to the models in Ryse.

    #5 6 months ago
  6. Hcw87

    This is impressive indeed, but lets hope they’ve done something with the terribad AI we’ve seen so far. If you can support 24 AI at once, they should atleast be pretty intelligent.

    #6 6 months ago
  7. KineticCalvaria

    Hold the phone, is it 60 fps for SP now as well? Or is he just referring to MP?

    #7 6 months ago
  8. Keivz

    @7
    Ninja’d.

    #8 6 months ago
  9. CyberMarco

    @4 He better not, if he doesn’t want to feel my wrath! :P

    #9 6 months ago
  10. Fin

    lol shitty consoles 60fps 1080p lol i only play 120fps on 4k with super mega ultra textures that are 1gb each in size
    all this on a pc i bought in 2008 for $50

    [/erth mode off]

    KZ SP fps is 30, MP is 60

    #10 6 months ago
  11. Hcw87

    @7
    SP is still at 30FPS, they haven’t announced that it’s 60 in SP.

    Hoping this won’t feel like playing GTAV all over again though.

    #11 6 months ago
  12. DrDamn

    @MonkeyGourmet
    Ryse model is now 85k for Marius – was reduced from original 150k in favour of no LoD and better shaders. KZ:SF is 40k at max LoD. Key point though is Marius is the main character for a third person game, you want him to have lots because he’s right there all the time. Does the 85k figure for Ryse apply to all character models or just Marius?

    #12 6 months ago
  13. Rockin a Jack D

    It’s still Killzone and it’s still shit…

    #13 6 months ago
  14. Legendaryboss

    @7/8
    The guy is Multiplayer lead, so likely only Multiplayer. But still a mistake.

    @9/10
    LOL, correct.

    #14 6 months ago
  15. illuminatusv

    @12: 85k models apply to all characters on screen! That was the trade off they made by reducing Marcus one single LOD. I think this is impressive.

    @14: Why should he mention AI if it is multiplayer, or they have something like Titanfall has with AI Players but I doubt it.

    #15 6 months ago
  16. monkeygourmet

    @12

    Sorry I was doing a troll! :)

    Just enjoying the next gen hypersensitivity going on at the mo, justify those pre-orders everyone! ;)

    It’s all futile, the Wii U still has the best line up…

    #16 6 months ago
  17. DrDamn

    @15
    I’ve only ever seen the 85k figure specifically attached to Marius. The tweet from Cevat Yerli gave the reasoning as … “Hero Marius 85k polys? It was choice: 150k polys w LODs vs 85K + better shading + no LODs (stable). The latter wo at better quality!”. Nothing about other characters.

    KZ:SF does online and offline bot matches.

    http://www.playstationlifestyle.net/2013/09/11/more-killzone-shadow-fall-multiplayer-details-cover-the-progression-system-bots-leaderboards-jetpacks-more/

    “Online and Offline Bots

    You can add bots to online matches for any Warzone you create. Human players can replace bots during the match, to ensure that there’s always a consistent amount of players present in the Warzone. You can even add bots to only one faction, to allow for ‘Bots vs. Humans’ type Warzones. In offline mode you can still create your own Warzones and play against bots, but you don’t have the ability to complete Challenges.”

    #17 6 months ago
  18. Legendaryboss

    @15
    AI in co-op? or Botzone, offline multiplayer?

    Edit: Damn you DrDamn, beat me :)

    #18 6 months ago
  19. Erthazus

    24 AI enemies on Screen. Does this game have an AI at all?
    Yesterday they already showed us what AI they have.

    You die – Little thing ressurects you and AI runs away for no reason at all without shooting little flying thing + it is also very blind if you are standing not in fron of him. So in other words nothing to brag about for a game that is 30 fps in singleplayer.
    + how much bodies PS4 can remember when you kill them off until it will start cleaning them? That’s also a question.

    #19 6 months ago
  20. Legendaryboss

    The moment you all have been waiting for…

    Erthazus arrives read his post for what he has to say.

    :D

    #20 6 months ago
  21. Erthazus

    @20, I don’t care about stupid trolling from stupid people that buy a system for Call of duty. So yeah, deal with it.

    #21 6 months ago
  22. illuminatusv

    @17: Did not know that Bot-matches are available in KZ. Thx!

    #22 6 months ago
  23. Ilovesony

    @10 can I have whatever it is your smoking?

    #23 6 months ago
  24. Belazur

    @Dumbass Erthazus making dumbass comment.
    News at 12

    #24 6 months ago
  25. Hcw87

    @19
    Actually you raise a good point, despawning bodies have been a HUGE letdown for me in the past.

    Skyrim was awesome at this, where stuff really never despawned unless you fast forwarded time.

    Obviously it’s a memory issue, so hopefully we’ll never see despawning bodies in any next gen game (especially when it’s just a normal FPS game). Pretty sure Dead Rising 3 with thousands of zombies on the screen will have some despawning though, and that will be a shame.

    #25 6 months ago
  26. DrDamn

    @25
    It depends on the game as to whether I find it an issue. Skyrim I always found impressive for stuff being where I left it. Pretty sure Knack de-spawns enemies after they die. Personally I wouldn’t really care in that sort of game though.

    #26 6 months ago
  27. Hcw87

    @26
    Yes, that’s what really put me off Knack. Destroying stuff, killing enemies and they’re despawning almost before hitting the floor.

    Same thing with Metal Gear Rising, it destroys immersion.

    #27 6 months ago
  28. DrDamn

    I don’t really have that much of a problem with a game like Knack doing it as it’s not an immersion sort of game. If it means a steady frame rate regardless of what mad things you try and it’s a reasonable compromise. Other games like RPGs or anything with more realistic graphics I’d find it off putting but not a deal breaker.

    #28 6 months ago
  29. tenthousandgothsonacid

    The single player runs at 30fps, only the multi at 60fps Mr Cook.

    #29 6 months ago
  30. Erthazus

    @25, Yeah. Skyrim really was good at that with memory. I think from a technical standpoint Skyrim was really great.

    “Same thing with Metal Gear Rising, it destroys immersion.”
    In Rising you had enemies that you can destroy in pieces. That is too much for a current gen.

    #30 6 months ago
  31. lookingglass

    Glorious PC Master Race.

    5 years. Mobile phone graphics will be on par with the PS4 in 5 years. In 5 years, consoles will be to PCs what muskets are to dark energy beam delocalizing pulse weapons

    #31 6 months ago
  32. Erthazus

    ^ Less than 5 years If we are going to believe Nvidia’s Next Roadmap for Nvidia Mobile graphics cards

    :D

    #32 6 months ago
  33. Panthro

    ^ And the newest architecture they are working on for the GTX 800 series, gunna blow everyone away apparently,. Cant wait!

    #33 6 months ago
  34. CyberMarco

    ^ “gunna blow everyone away apparently”

    especially consumer’s pocket!

    #34 6 months ago
  35. fearmonkey

    The game looks really good, and I’m eager to play it, thats all I can say.

    24 characters at one time is a ton on screen that all have separate AI, most games have leass than half that, so I see noting to complain about. I’m just glad it’s 1080p, doesn’t matter to me in SP if its less than 60fps.

    #35 6 months ago
  36. Panthro

    @34 I’m not so sure, nvidia always give plenty of options for people with different budgets.

    #36 6 months ago
  37. Erthazus

    @34, you know. You can always buy yourself a budget videocard and be done with it.
    Who want’s the best will buy the best.

    simple as that.

    #37 6 months ago
  38. deathm00n

    @36 And they work so well that you wonder if what you bought was in reality just a potato disguised as a videocard. Been there.

    #38 6 months ago
  39. pcbros

    I can spend $200 for a GTX660 with a free copy of Batman Origins ($50) that will keep me gaming for a long time.

    Not everyone needs a GTX780 or Titan…

    #39 6 months ago
  40. CyberMarco

    And yet a (2010) 600€+ GTX 480 struggles with “next-gen” games.

    @Panthro, I was referring to the 8xx price range, that it’ll not only blow everyone in terms of performance, but in terms of price too.

    @Erth, so money isn’t a factor now, is it?

    P.S. I got my GTX 480 for 180€ from EVGA, so you know before you say something funny.

    #40 6 months ago
  41. Panthro

    @38 Well thats to bad that you skimped on value and got tricked into buying a tatie.

    #41 6 months ago
  42. Panthro

    @40 Yeah i know, Im just hopeful they dont get to expensive for the mid-high ones, I usually go for the 70s or 80s, Last year I got a EVGA 670 FTW which is on par with a factory clocked 680, for price to performance I think it was well worth the money.#

    EDIT – found this table of GFlops per watt in their GPU’s before now and what they are currently working on ‘Maxwell’

    http://semiaccurate.com/static/uploads/2010/09_september/NV_roadmap_small.png

    #42 6 months ago
  43. CyberMarco

    @42 Usually the x70 starts at ~400-450€ and the x80 at 600€+. So much for a high end graphics card that’ll be irrelevant 2-3 years after release. It’s simple their tactics to make their products less reliable and working.

    Pff… capitalism and stuff like that, go figure!

    #43 6 months ago
  44. Gekidami

    What graphics cards can do would be relevant if games were actually made to take advantage of them. They’re not of course, games on PC take lower end spec PC’s more into consideration than they do high end ones because more people have them. Thats why the number of PC games actually pushing impressive visuals can be counted on one hand. The rest are either on current console standard or have just a few extra options like high resolution and whatnot. That makes them look better, sure, but you’re kidding yourselves if you think PC gaming is this whole new generation of visuals. PC games only look as good as the devs make them based on the hardware the majority use, and that hardware majority is middling. Looking at the current trend of PC sales its not going to change any time soon either, it might even get worst, actually.

    #44 6 months ago
  45. wildBoar

    Tried buying a new dslr camera the other day.. Made me wanna kill myself. No matter what you buy, you’ll feel like you’re getting screwed over. And those fucking lenses!!! They’re priced as if they were made of diamonds.

    As long as next gen has 60fps, that’s all I care about. Between exclusives, ease of use and bang for your bucks, I’d say consoles still more than justify themselves.

    #45 6 months ago
  46. CyberMarco

    @44 And yet I couldn’t get a solid 40+ FPS in BF4 Beta with an i7-950, gtx 480 and 6gb Ram on LOW.

    Lazy fucks!

    #46 6 months ago
  47. Panthro

    @43 irrelevant? not likely… If you wanna keep the GPU up to par with what the consoles would be running you would simply set the games with no AA and sometimes at 720p.

    Dont forget, this generation coming is different… the consoles had the edge last time for the start but technology is growing faster these days and their are cards out on the market that surpass what the PS4 and X1 can do by 2x and that wasn’t the case when the 360 and PS3 came out.

    #47 6 months ago
  48. CPC_RedDawn

    @46

    Let me give you some insight into the PC hardware world.

    CPU manufacturers like Intel don’t really like to market their CPU’s are “gaming” CPU’s. Sure they use gaming from time to time but not only gaming. They also control the speeds at which their architectures run at so they can price them accordingly. So why don’t you try overclocking that i7-950 which should be pretty easy. I bet at stock speeds its bottlenecking that GTX480 also overclocking the 480 would also be a good start. Then throwing in another 4GB RAM at least would also help out with newer games such as BF4.

    Motherboard manufacturers are the ones that really push the gaming marketing as they build their boards with overclocking in mind as 9 times out of 10 you need to overclock your CPU in order to use even a mid-range GPU to its full potential. GPU architectures have come leaps and bounds in the past 10 years whilst CPU speeds and efficiency has dried up seen as AMD are giving Intel little to no competition meaning Intel can do what they like.

    Also, BF4 is an AMD Never Settle game and have had massive problems on the Nvidia side of the gate. Make sure you are using the latest drivers optimized for BF4.

    Remember with PC gaming comes the need to know how to look after your hardware making sure its software it either working or up to date. Consoles you just plug and play and if it looks terrible or has horrid frame rates your stuck with it.

    Remember also, your i7 950 CPU came out in 2009 you could easily get that to or past 4GHz with the right cooling and it will feed that 480 much nicer.

    One more thing, the GTX400 series of cards was a well known disaster for Nvidia. Based on the Fermi architecture it was troubled from the start they couldn’t get the yields up to exceptable levels and were behind AMD at the time so they turned off shader units to get the levels up to scratch. The GTX480 was meant to have 512 CUDA cores not 480, they had to drop the other cores in order to get them out to market but still the cards produced a ton of heat and needed a lot of power. Hence the funny advert from AMD that followed shortly after. They also hindered the performance of the card by only putting 1.5GB VRAM on the board to keep costs down when it should of been 2GB. Once they sorted out the issues with yields they released the GTX580 which had the full amount of CUDA cores and still to this day performs extremely well.

    I used to have a GTX480 which I overclocked, and an i7-920 which I also overclocked and 6GB RAM. I could easily play Skyrim @ 1080p maxed out with over 40 mods hald of them were texture or graphical mods. I still got a solid 60fps. If I put everything back to stock clocks I got around 45fps.

    Right now I have two rigs one of which cost me a ridiculous amount of money and the other is an i7-960 @ 4.2GHz, HD7970 @ 1150/1650, 12GB RAM, 256GB SSD. And on that rig at 1080p Ultra settings I get 67fps avg in BF4 and lowest of 51fps.

    Overclocking the CPU is generally a must for high end PC’s as no CPU out there can really push high end GPU’s only if you get into the stupidly overpriced Xeons or X79 platform like the i74960X.

    #48 6 months ago
  49. CyberMarco

    @48 Thanks for the insight. I’m not that clueless regarding maintaining and taking care of my rig. When I built my PC in late 2010, it was built with a budget in mind, and knowing how this market works, by the time you assemble a rig, the next upgrade is released just a few weeks/months later! -.-

    I know I can push my hardware with OC, but I still need a decent after-market cooler, that would be ~40/50€ for air-cooling, or 80-90€ for all-in-one water cooling solution, like the Corsair Hydro series.

    Anyhow, my point is that the way the market is handled, Intel being the major producer of CPUs, almost monopolizing the market and with AMD trying to catch Nvidia in the GPU sector you have to ask yourself if there is any “lobby” regarding producing and pricing of the hardware.

    All in all, the PC isn’t an easy venture for average-Joe to start messing around. I’m a PC gamer and console gamer and can see that each platform has its advantages and disadvantages.

    @Panthro, irrelevant not compared to consoles, but to other PC hardware and how they are performing compared to the said x70s and x80s.

    #49 6 months ago
  50. CathyKarr09

    First time i trusted an online job add and managed to make 90$ in 5 hours… Bow6com

    #50 6 months ago
  51. ctankep

    @48

    Appreciate your post –
    Wasn’t sure about 7970s for a setup.
    Do they suffer from being noisy?

    #51 6 months ago