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Wii U first-party releases delayed due to requiring “more development resources than expected”

Tuesday, 30th April 2013 16:35 GMT By Stephany Nunneley

Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has told investors the reason for the delayed release of many first-party titles was due to Wii U launch titles requiring “more development resources than expected.”

Speaking during a financial call after Nintendo posted its yearly results last week, Iwata said in order for launch titles to be made available alongside the console, staff members from other development teams such as Pikmin 3 were pulled into other projects in order to get them out the door. This caused a release delay for future releases.

“We do not simply have one easily identifiable bottleneck in software development,” he said. “These days it is becoming increasingly challenging to determine the minimum development resources required for customer satisfaction.

“The point I am trying to get across is that currently it is more challenging to sell packaged software for around $50-$60. On the other hand, we can offer digital games in other formats. It is true that it is becoming increasingly challenging to meet the expectations of consumers who are willing to pay $50-$60 for a game, and it is difficult to break even unless a huge number of units is sold all over the world, so it cannot be denied that software development is becoming more challenging.

“Among such packaged software, however, the sales of popular games are much larger than in the past. Therefore, if we create more hit games, the software development business can still be very profitable. All games break even if they sell millions of copies worldwide, so we will continue to do our best to develop games which have high sales potential.”

Iwata told investors one of the ways he hopes to make the console more appealing to consumers, is to expand the range of software available for Wii U, such as with the recent release of Wii Street U powered by Google. In order to do this, the firm has expanded the range of software developers for the console, and is looking to bring in more developers verses in Unity, HTML5 and JavaScript.

“We have started working to expand the range of software developers for Wii U, as I announced in the Corporate Management Policy Briefing in January,” said Iwata. “As I mentioned just before, the development challenges for home console games selling for around $50-$60 have increased significantly.

“Therefore, we need to expand the range of software developers. The number of developers who can use versatile web technologies such as HTML5 and JavaScript is probably more than 100 times larger than that of the current software developers for dedicated gaming machines. We would like them to create software for our console. Developers can now use Unity for Wii U development, and we have started offering it to the developers. There are over a million Unity developers, including many in developing countries where the business of dedicated gaming machines is not prosperous.

“We would like to create opportunities for these developers to have their games available for Wii U. We hope that these actions to expand the range of software developers. It is a fact that some software development companies assume that Wii U is not powerful enough. On the contrary, some developers say in interviews that Wii U has a different architecture from other consoles and that, when utilized in the right way, it can perform well.

“At the moment, there is a great deal of contradictory information. Nintendo is required to make more efforts to dispel such a misconception. In fact, some software companies are actively supporting Wii U and others are not. It is important to have supportive companies enjoy successful sales of a game and feel that their decision to develop something for Wii U was correct.”

Iwata said such a thing could not be achieved “overnight” but the firm is working to revitalize the Wii U market by showing “favorable results for third-party software” starting this summer.

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51 Comments

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  1. DSB

    I think it’s truly worrying that these concerns have been completely obvious to anyone watching Nintendo long before the Wii U came along.

    Clueless leadership is clueless.

    #1 12 months ago
  2. Lengendaryboss

    Oh Nintendo its bad enough the Wii U and 3DS ain’t successful like it is in Japan (Speaking for 3DS mainly), its bad enough that i think your consoles are for families and its bad enough you do not release any new IPs.

    #2 12 months ago
  3. The_Red

    Nintendo experience what other devs and console makers experienced 7-8 years ago: Making games for a HD consoles. Low res textures and low poly models of Wii were much cheaper than the stuff needed for HD games.

    The big question is, when will the dev teams fully catch up? Wii U needs a super strong stream of first party games like 3DS to survive (Sorry but as much as I love Bayonetta 2, W101 and Rayman Legends, they will not help console sales one bit).

    #3 12 months ago
  4. OlderGamer

    I think he spoke some truth.

    But I think he is wrong in thinking that deversified software is a solution. Google Street isn’t going to move WiiU systems. For the most part App are a bonus, they by themself, I don’t believe, sell systems. Having Netflix is a big deal, but people that generaly buy a system just for Netflix I would think is low reletive to the number of people willing to buy a system for the games.

    I think it has everything to do with price. And maybe something to do with a promise.

    I mean the WiiU is too expensive. I don’t believe Nintendo has a lot of wiggle room right now. But the price needs to come down and fast, and prolly alot.

    But what I think is keeping the system from gaining traction isn’t all just the consumer. I think it is the notion that the next gen systems from Sony and MS will be so amazing that the WiiU will be pointless to own.

    I think that a great deal of both Media and Publishers feel that way. And I think, to a lesser degree that is reflected in gamers. Certianly in gamers that come here. But not nesecarly to the average gamer.

    But I think what people are going to find is that the next gen systems aren’t going to be these amazing Pixar Studio level graphical powerhouses. I think they will be nice upgrades. But not amazing. Also expect those upgrades to come at a cost. One that the mass market may not be too eager to invest in.

    But the industry leaders already know this. They also know that sales have peaked somewhere between 2007 and 2008. And that the market has been sagging. The industry NEEDS to create a lot of buz going into next gen. They need you so freaken excited to play PS4 and XBnxt that you already have preorders. But you and I don’t drive the industry anymore.

    It is the legions of gamers somewhere between casual and core that matter the most. The gamers that own FIFA just to play with the guys on Saturday night. Or the Millions of COD junkies that are more excited about Ghost then buying a new system.

    Just don’t be shocked if the new systems don’t also hit a wall after seemingly healthy launches. I think alot of this just has to do with shifts in the marketplace. And ofc, price. Alot of companies are struggling to find traction.

    #4 12 months ago
  5. Francis O

    @LengendaryBoss, The 3DS is doing really good! Just because it’s not doing as well worldwide as it is in Japan, is ok. The 3DS is crushing the Vita in the US and Europe as well as Japan.

    And if you really think Nintendo doesn’t make New IPs, I suggest you google a list of new IPs Nintendo has made since 2008 or so. I’ll give you a small list here though.

    1. Xenoblade -2010 (Japan) 2011 (Euro) – Wii
    2. The Last Story – 2010 (Japan) 2011 (Euro) – Wii
    3. Glory of Heracles – 2008 (Japan) 2010 (US) – DS
    4. Dillons Rolling Western – 2012 (Worldwide) – N3DS eshop
    5. Pandora’s Tower 2011 (Japan) 2012,2013 (EU, NA) – Wii
    6. Disaster Day of Crisis (Japan) 2008 Euro (2008) – Wii
    7. Soma Bringer (Japan) 2008 – There’s English patch available online, the game is awesome. – DS

    - And that’s the short list, there are more, these are just some of the more popular ones. It’s a misconception Nintendo doesn’t make new IPs. There new IPs just are as abundant as there franchises that have been around forever like Mario.

    #5 12 months ago
  6. Joe Musashi

    Many on that list are second-party. Which misses the point of this news article completely – and also the point about Nintendo‘s own creation/lack of creation of IP.

    Francis, you frequently paint in enthusiastic broad strokes. But the devil is in the details.

    JM

    #6 12 months ago
  7. Imperius

    Francis O is a Nintendo fanboy.

    I am a fan of games and “competing” hardware. Finally this will be start of Nintendo’s fall. By the end of next year I see them giving up. Hopefully they don’t drag it out that long and put Zelda on my PC, PS4, and my Nextbox. They just need to realize they can’t compete anymore in the department of hardware. It’s sad that laptops are more powerful then thier newest system the Wii U.

    The system isn’t selling for one good reason. It’s not next gen yet claims it is, people got fooled by the Wii (not I) but since then many have seen it sit there and collect dust while they play thier PC’s, Xbox 360′s, and PS3′s that actually have games and work with thier HD TV’s. Nintendo just last year made a HD console (that performs poorly). While Sony and Microsoft have been doing it for years.

    Just stick to what you’re good at Nintendo and that’s games leave hardware up to people who know what they are doing.

    #7 12 months ago
  8. Lengendaryboss

    @Francis
    I knew my comment would attract you. PS Vita being crushed by 3DS is irrelevant, i never mentioned it and what about Wii U can you only focus on Successful Nintendo platforms. By new IPs i meant created by first party teams and being as notable as Mario, Zelda and Pokemon.
    Oh and Francis i think you deserve a promotion from “guardian angel” to “King suck up of Nintendo” or “guardian protector of Nintendo” Which do you like best? :D

    #8 12 months ago
  9. ManuOtaku

    To the klist given by francis i will like to add that since the late 90 early 2000, we have seen new ip`s like custom robo, chibi robot, batallion wars, pikmin, luigis mansion,captain rainbown,dynamic blade, etc, i think from first party perspective is ok, adding to the second party titles mentioned by francis, although i understand that the thing is that nintendo is making now HD games something that requieres more money, effort and time, and that will mean more needed sells to be succesfull, sadly, i think nintendo were happy not knowing this situation that made a lot developers having big problems to stay open.

    Regarding nintendo getting out of business, i will ask people why they really want this?,besides fanboy wars reasoning, because if nintendo becames software only that will meant their future demise much like sega right now, and if thats the case, whats the good in that, i think the will leave a hughe hole in this industry because, kids, family games and the hardcore gamers that have little kids kicking inside them, will have a void that will be hard to fill for the other offerings, i dont want my kids to be raised by the offerings of sony and microsoft alone, so again i will ask why theres people that want something like this and the reaons for wishing this?,

    #9 12 months ago
  10. Francis O

    @Joe
    Soma Bringer, Disaster,Xenoblade,Glory of H, and Dillons Rolling are all first party. The rest are second. Nintendo had over 80 employees work on The Last Story, I don’t see why you’re trying to discredit it by saying it’s second party like it doesn’t count. It’s a new IP funded by Nintendo.

    @ Imperius, I’m a Nintendo fanboy because I stated the obvious? The 3DS is crushing the PS Vita….. right? Then I listed new IPs by Nintendo. I like Nintendo, but it not like I said anything untrue….

    @8 Lengendaryboss
    “3DS ain’t successful like it is in Japan (Speaking for 3DS mainly)”
    That’s not talking about the 3DS?

    It seems like you’re trying to discredit Nintendo’s success with 3DS. We all know Japan likes portables more. 31 million units sold is nothing to scoff at man.

    When speaking about Nintendo, I don’t understand why people will discredit Nintendo by mentioning well a new IP has to be from the Zelda or Mario team. A new IP is a new IP. Xenoblade is a new IP by Nintendo thats awesome. I don’t give a shit if it’s by the Mario or Zelda team. it’s a bad ass new IP.

    And once again you fail to do your homework. One of the new IPs I didn’t list, HarmoKnight, is made by GameFreak, the people who make Pokemon. And like I stated previously about 80 members of the Mario Team worked on The Last Story.

    And I like “guardian protector of Nintendo” has a nice ring to it. And I think it’s better than being called the boring and over-used ‘fanboy’

    #10 12 months ago
  11. Clupula

    @8 – I still like him being considered their “Guardian Angel,” only because it makes me his opposite number.

    Although “P. R. Guardian Angel” might be a better title.

    #11 12 months ago
  12. OlderGamer

    Also, new IP doesn’t always mean more sales. I know Sony and MS fans like to rip Nintendo for what they precieve as lack of new IP. But Nintendo changes up their IPs. So that the franchises are there but tweaks, improvments are added so that the gameplay experience remans unique. Not in every case ofc, but enough to keep people coming back for more. Perhaps the same type of way a CoD games does. Or a Halo game.

    This is the day and age of name brand franchises. New IP are welcome by alot of core gamers, prolly because we are jaded and a bit burnt out, but in terms of actual sales. I don’t think it can be proven that new IP generate more sales then a franchise already established can.

    You won’t see MS, Sony, EA, or Acti throwing away their top teir franchises…why should Nintendo?

    Also, Sega switching to software only hasn’t exactly taken them to the top of the publishing world.

    Even tho WiiU is struggling right, I think Nintendo is on the mostly right course. Gameboy is continues to do well. And I think as costs come down, the next gen glitz fades into reality, and more first party games roll out WiiU will pick up. I doubt it will ever reach 100million systems sold. I am not sure PS4 or XBnxt will either. WiiU isn’t going to match Wii. But I think it will sell good enough and keep nintendo moving forward.

    #12 12 months ago
  13. Francis O

    @ Clupula, no…. you’ll always be know as a ‘The douchebag’ to me.

    If I’m a PR man, cause I actually know what I’m talking about when it comes to Nintendo. Fine.

    LegendaryBoss says the Pokemon team didn’t make any new IPs, yet HarmoKnight is available to download right now on the eShop by GameFreak.

    VG247 has a lot of people who just talk shit about Nintendo, yet don’t know what there talking about.

    Nintendo has made plenty of new IPs. I just listed them, and I’m being called a fanboy for that. This community is a bit pathetic.

    #13 12 months ago
  14. DSB

    Nintendo are victims of their past.

    Betting everything on ultra-friendly games aimed at the whole family was a hard sell even for the Gamecube, and I don’t think the Wii would have had a chance if it hadn’t been because its controls put it in a class of its own.

    Whether Nintendo (and their fans) like it or not, they do have to compete with everyone else, and they can’t defend being so far behind the pack anymore.

    #14 12 months ago
  15. ManuOtaku

    #14 DSB i think all the companies are victims of the past, sony for their success on the previous two generations made them victim this generation, and this happened to nintendo as well, back in the SNES and NES era, therefore i think that applies to all and is cyclical

    Now for the far behind the pack, that depends on the eye of the beholder, DRM, always connected online for singleplayer, DLC, focus on multimedia things, are not that great for gaming, so in a few instances being far behind the pack is rather good, i would had agree with you if they were far behind in the quality on the games, but nintendo games are equally as good as any other developer out there.

    #15 12 months ago
  16. Lengendaryboss

    @Francis
    Lengendaryboss says first party teams don’t make New IPs, i am well aware of GameFreak the second party team (Which i am surprised Nintendo haven’t bought yet) HarmoKnight New IP effort. Don’t place words where they never existed.

    @OlderGamer
    True no one wants to throw away their top selling franchises, but besides MS and Sony focusing on GT and Halo since inception of their respective consoles, they do invest in notable New IPs: Sony more than MS.

    #16 12 months ago
  17. Joe Musashi

    @10 “It’s new IP funded by Nintendo.”

    Which is categorically not first-party developed-by-Nintendo (the point that was raised and the area of focus of this news-article). I’ve seen this before – others over-eager to give Nintendo credit for another’s work just because they threw some money at it. That doesn’t make it first party and it doesn’t mean those titles qualify as evidence of Nintendo developing new IP.

    It’d be like saying that Microsoft developed Gears of War as a new IP. Or, if you prefer, Sony developed Heavy Rain as a new IP. They didn’t. And those games are not first-party games either.

    “VG247 has a lot of people who just talk shit about Nintendo, yet don’t know what there talking about.”

    Oh please. Your own arguments have had many factual inaccuracies and you have no qualms talking shit about platform manufacturers when it suits you. You’re no different.

    JM

    #17 12 months ago
  18. DSB

    @15 But Microsoft and Sony aren’t paying nearly the same price for it, because they have broad appeal and (more) modern tech and design. Nintendos games may be perfectly good quality, but they appeal to the very same group.

    Primarily japanese-styled family friendly games. Allowing Microsoft and Sony to play the field while you continue to paint yourself into a corner isn’t the best way to ensure you’ll still be relevant tomorrow.

    And it’s a huge problem for Nintendo. Their console isn’t interesting this time around, the Wii’s “wow” factor has long since faded, and they haven’t made a serious effort to bring in the kinds of third parties that could’ve made a big difference for them now.

    #18 12 months ago
  19. Lengendaryboss

    @JM
    Oh thank you, i was just about to explain that.

    #19 12 months ago
  20. fearmonkey

    Nintendo would have less of a problem right now if they had more third party titles in Development. The problem is that Nintendo has to release alot of AAA titles themselves, and Ubisoft and few others cant make up for the slack.

    Also, OlderGamer is right about price but I wonder if it would have been $250 that it would have sold much better? The Wii was competing with $399 and $499 consoles at the time, and now the Xbox360 and PS3 are cheaper and have more games and history behind them.

    Unlike some I would absolutely hate to see Nintendo bow out of making consoles. I want them to remain in the business but admittedly I want the Nintendo of old, that made cool powerful consoles and not ones that looked like it was made by Fisher Price (Gamecube) or for the casual market.

    I’d love Nintendo to release a sleek futuristic system again and not be so much about motion controls and gimmicks.

    and man id love a new Sega console, its a dream but oh well……….

    #20 12 months ago
  21. ManuOtaku

    #18 I think nintendo games appeal to the same group but they also expand it by newcomers kids become also future avid gamers that will support their IP`S, as they will do support the other two as well, but they are developing the future gamers of tomorrow.

    Also for every family friendly game on nintendo catalog there is also a very core experience that can be enjoyed for the avid crow, they also offer a lot of variety in their games, there is something to everybody.

    As for the WiiU not being interesting, i think is not for that that is having the problems, it is because there is not that many games and the cost of the console is not user friendly, adding the need for the extra cost of a pro controller, if they correct this it will do good a console between the range of 50-70 million units is not that bad, and those numbers are reachable if they do some fixes, i think games like zombie u are an example of the interesting aspect of the console, sadly they are not that many out there like it.

    #21 12 months ago
  22. DSB

    @21 What they have is a console that has struggled since it’s unveiling. It’s been an unmitigated failure from day one.

    There were core games on the Wii, but as far as I know, not a single one of them broke 2 million copies. It was a waste of money for third parties, unless you happened to be selling Just Dance.

    #22 12 months ago
  23. ManuOtaku

    #22 well DSB i meant nintendo titles when i said core offerings, and those offerings reaching a lot of gamers, avid ones and newcomers, because i believe nintendo needs a console of their own to bring their games to the market, if they go software only they will have a hard time doing that, just like sega.

    And i like to add that is possible the biggest problem nintendo has, i mean that other developers offerings doesnt sell that well on nintendo consoles and i think it is something that it has not an easier fix, because in a way they are competing with nintendo, something that is hard to do in their own console.

    #23 12 months ago
  24. monkeygourmet

    Lets be honest….

    Most Nintendo fans shouldn’t bother commenting at the moment.

    People bash Nintendo regardless and it ALWAYS remains the same;

    Nintendo manages to release some of the highest rated and most quality games of a generation. Gameplay and art design always piss all over most triple A’s from other companies.

    People want NEW stuff however… And on first look, Nintendo rehash stuff. That’s true to a degree, but the gameplay is always mixed up as @OG, @Poly & @Manu have mentioned before.

    Case in point:

    They are the most successful company in managing to take 2D games and switch them into 3D without compromising gameplay…

    Metroid
    Zelda
    Mario

    All stone cold classics in there many incarnations.

    For a Nintendo fan, it’s best just to wait this out till Nintendo sorts its release schedule, pretty shit if its your ONLY console (how many of those people are out there?!), but once the good stuff starts flowing… WHAMMO!

    Killzone vs. Metroid U
    Mario 3DU vs. Knack
    Zelda U vs. Team ICO

    Etc… Etc…

    Nintendo usually end up with the prime examples of quality in a generation, and I don’t see e Wii U being any different…

    The fact the gameplay will probably kick the next gen machines ass is just even more fun to watch! :)

    #24 12 months ago
  25. Francis O

    @Joe
    The main difference between Sony with Heavy Rain, and MS with Gears of War is they didn’t have developers from their companies actually working on the title.

    What you brought up with Heavy Rain and Gears of War, is like Nintendo’s situation with The Wonderul 101. It’s completely funded by Nintendo, but it’s being solely worked on by Platinum Games.

    While Nintendo doesn’t own Mistwalker, plenty of Nintendo employees from the Mario club helped with the development, strategy, characters, ect of the game. The same goes for Pandora’s tower.

    So yes, those are Nintendo’s new IPs. Sakaguchi even stated that The Last Story would have been impossible to make without the ‘development help’ of the Mario team.

    So give them credit were credit is due. Nintendo makes new IPs, weather it’s with another company or not, all that matters is if the game is good.

    #25 12 months ago
  26. Lengendaryboss

    @25
    Oh boy you are really stuck in Nintendo world aren’t you Francis, you think what you want technically it is still a second party New IP whether or not Nintendo teams help out or not, it is NOT A FIRST PARTY IP get it guardian angel.

    #26 12 months ago
  27. Francis O

    @LegendaryBoss

    Stuck in the Nintendo world? Everything I said about The Last Story and Pandora’s tower is factually correct. If you can prove me otherwise with links that would be great.

    To me, new IP is new IP. If Nintendo’s core teams are helping to make new IPs, what does it matter if it’s not only by them?

    Just as long as the quality is just as good as a Mario or Zelda game, I don’t see why there is a need to formulate the distinction. It’s Nintendo’s core teams, helping to make new IPs

    Sony gets credit for Heavy Rain as a new IP, yet it’s made by Quantic Dream. And to me, it doesn’t matter. It’s a new IP from Sony.

    #27 12 months ago
  28. Lengendaryboss

    ^As true as that is
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_Freak
    Still states they are Second Party so i am just stating facts.
    Pokemon is a Franchise that is milked alongside other big Nintendo franchises, whereas HarmoKnight is not. its made by a second party team it is a second party game doesn’t matter about the association Nintendo has with GameFreak http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/top10/497.html its as simple as that. First Party Team = First Party Game Second Party Team = Second Party Game.

    Publishers who fund developers games deserve as much credit as the developers. So Nintendo deserve credit for the games they publish alongside any other publishers.

    #28 12 months ago
  29. theevilaires

    Wow they need more development time to re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re the same old kind of games :( And people talk crap about SONY making games thats are fresh and new like Beyond. I bought two of these things because Nintendo showed me they wanted to apologize to the hardcore for that piece of shit wii. But it was all a lie…again. I’ve lost all faith in this company ever going back to its glory days.

    Once a safe hack for the Wii U is discovered I’m gonna pirate the shit out of Nintendo software. Consider that my payment Nintendo for investing in you and getting nothing back in return.

    #29 12 months ago
  30. monkeygourmet

    @29

    Why 2?!

    Just sell them dude, obviously not for you! :)

    #30 12 months ago
  31. theevilaires

    ^ I wanted both colors…I’m anal like that :P and they are for me because I love Zelda and I and many other hardcore gamers deserve a 720P/1080P 60FPS Zelda dammit!

    #31 12 months ago
  32. Joe Musashi

    @27 blurring the lines doesn’t make black white. First party is first party, second party is second party. They are two distinct and separate things. You keep describing the former and trying to pass it off as the latter.

    “To me, new ip is new ip”

    That’s is beside the point of what was being discussed. Specifically NINTENDO developing new ip. Now you’re abandoning the first/second party aspect central to the discussion and are happy to just give new ip credit where Nintendo can be vaguely associated with it.

    That’s a pretty poor turn for someone getting on their high horse about ‘not knowing what they’re talking about’. You no longer appear to care about the factual details if it means your favoured platform manufacturer can’t benefit from them.

    By your logic Nintendo made Lost Odyssey for the 360 because people who worked at Mistwalker also were involved with Nintendo previously.

    See? It doesn’t make sense to use your logic. All you have to do is stop revolving every detail around Nintendo in order to see it.

    “It’s a new IP from Sony”

    No it’s not. If that’s how you genuinely see things then you really should not be accusing anyone else about not knowing what they’re talking about.

    As for @24 – making comparisons of unannounced games to unreleased games and saying whose are better….? Really? Jeez.

    I’m reminded how a lot of effort came from certain quarters recently about how you can’t possibly assess something if you hadn’t used it yourself. That logic got wheeled out numerous time to outright dismiss the views of some that others did not agree with. Not to discuss but to dismiss. It’d be nice if that principle was applied with a little more consistency.

    JM

    #32 12 months ago
  33. monkeygourmet

    @31

    Unfortunatly everything is ‘on hold’ until the PS4 comes out… :(

    They should do an ‘ambassador’ program like they did with the 3DS to make up for it IMO

    #33 12 months ago
  34. monkeygourmet

    @32

    You can kind of do that by using history to help you predict…

    Cool eh?!

    Similar, to how People keep righting Nintendo off again and again and get proven wrong every time.

    You are allowed to make predictions you know… I’m not saying its in the bag, I’m just looking at the previous quality of these releases, Metroid, Killzone etc…

    #34 12 months ago
  35. Joe Musashi

    Or, perhaps it just nothing more than simple bias being masqueraded as something more profound. The moving of goalposts in this discussion certainly give that impression.

    JM

    #35 12 months ago
  36. NeutralBlade

    Next-gen consoles will face the same challenges and will cost developers, publishers, and consumers more money. Nintendo is just stating the obvious, which increased cost and longer development time, is a part of the business.

    They have to make these obvious statements, due to the market rushing them as if they’re on a timer; and when it’s up, it’s game over. They’re in a position to be the cheaper console with a more unique experience, along with full BC support and mostly free online.

    The 720 and PS4 will cost a lot more money in the long run, and that will set in after launch. It remains to be seen if Xbox Live will change to a monthly sub cost, as it’s not clear that the standalone system will be charged the same amount. They have to make their money back on the $300 package with the $10 for 2 years fee, and it’s possible that console will be the lesser console package, not the fully featured one at $500.

    It would be a bold move to give 2 years of Xbox Live away for only $40, (when you do the calculations), but it seems that there will be a cost-saving measure in there somewhere. To speak on the PS4′s online services, it’s been reported it may cost as much as next-gen Live, which I believe will happen for sure. I see no reason for fanboys to brag about a mostly free service they’re going to lose come the PS4 and the eventual cancellation of free PS3 online.

    Neither Microsoft or Sony will support both platforms for a lengthy period of time, and a free online service is a lot more likely to lose features, change to a mostly pay model, or be discontinued earlier, versus the current Live pay model. But here’s to hoping the current systems will get at least 3 more years of full online support, before said services are discontinued.

    Nintendo has time to catch up software-wise, because the new consoles will be directly competing with the current 360 and PS3, as well as have a limited selection of titles within its first year on the market. Developers stand to lose more money doing two game releases on current and next-gen consoles, versus choosing only one platform from Microsoft and Sony.

    The new tech next-gen will receive, is already available on PCs, and it’s not as groundbreaking as people want to think it is. It’s going to all come at a cost, and next-gen will certainly have it’s own growing pains, should the cost of games increase. Gaming companies are at risk of losing a lot more money on next-gen, should they stick with the current $60 asking price.

    The way I see it, is that Nintendo has a lesser challenge to take on, as both the 360 and PS3 will lose software and online support in the future, while it lives on in the coming years. Once the new consoles are out and reality sets in, Nintendo will pick up the pace and do just fine. They can even sit in third place and make a profit like in the days of the GCN, while Microsoft and Sony hemorrhage money. Whether if Nintendo is #1, or in 3rd with the Wii U marketed like the Wii was as a companion console, they stand to do well in this very different market of gaming.

    The least capable console has lead the gaming market these past 3 generations. And while that won’t always be the case, it does state that it will take more than graphics to lead a generation. Until they can revolutionize gaming engines to do more than just display better graphics, I really don’t see Nintendo being left behind at all. The Wii U’s graphics are easily better than current gen, and that’s certainly enough with their current disc format.

    To speak on IPs, most companies aren’t consistently making new IPs, and Nintendo usually makes highly-rated games that aren’t yearly releases shoved down your throat. I see nothing wrong with continuing a successful product, as it’s good for business and for gamers. Like when Rare was sold to Microsoft, Nintendo’s IP will remain with them, even if the exclusive contract ended with a second-party.

    So regardless of who develops it, it’s still owned by Nintendo, which is why certain IPs are called first-party, though an (exclusive) second-party developer is making it. So unless Nintendo goes multi-platform, you won’t ever see a series like Pokemon on a competitor’s console, even if the developer parted ways; Nintendo will just continue the IP with another developer.

    Some speak of wanting the death of Nintendo or at least a transition to software only? Unless you looking forward to more expensive consoles and games from M&S if Nintendo goes, then you should wish them well; rather than predict their demise. Everything will cost more without Nintendo, and the console era will move even quicker toward its end without them.

    #36 12 months ago
  37. monkeygourmet

    @36

    Flawless victory!!!

    Really well said, pretty much sums things up for me.

    You can’t really argue with any of the points you made and its a great summery of how next gen is shaping up and how Nintendo will operate in this space.

    Good stuff :)

    #37 12 months ago
  38. Clupula

    @13 – @ Clupula, no…. you’ll always be know as a ‘The douchebag’ to me.

    Only because I’m constantly in your vagina.

    #38 12 months ago
  39. Joe Musashi

    @36 “So regardless of who develops it, it’s still owned by Nintendo, which is why certain IPs are called first-party, though an (exclusive) second-party developer is making it”

    Except that’s factually incorrect. At the start of this ‘discussion’ facts seemed to be very important to people.

    Now, those same people care little for the facts, instead favouring to redefine terms like “First Party” and “Second Party” into something that allows them to give their favoured platform manufacturer credit where it doesn’t deserve.

    And the rest of the conversation has devolved into the usual console-wars stuff. Lots of off-topic speculation being thrown about which only serves to take the spotlight off the issue that is being reported which some would prefer to bury because they regard it as ‘mindless Nintendo bashing’. It’s not.

    If you can’t or won’t stick to the facts or even stick to the point and need to twist and turn and obfuscate then that speaks volumes.

    regardless of who develops it

    That is the key detail of all of this. Dismissing who develops something (not who owns, funds, or which platform it is exclusive to – which are not the same thing as development at all) is to dismiss the entire issue wholesale.

    JM

    #39 12 months ago
  40. Clupula

    @39 – Basically what it boils down to is any facts that speak negatively about Nintendo don’t matter and should be ignored. Article about first party releases says something negative about them? Why, just throw in some second party titles in order to “prove” it wrong because to just accept the facts would be considered anti-Nintendo.

    It’s a very typical, very human response, though. Why work to make things better? Why try to change what is obviously a problem? When, instead, one can hide behind a brand and, smile, and say, “Everything is alright. Everything is fine. If you say there’s any sort of problem, obviously you just hate that brand, and should be ignored.”

    #40 12 months ago
  41. Dragon246

    @JM, Clupula,
    +1
    I would have brought some more facts, but lets save them any more heartburns :D

    #41 12 months ago
  42. polygem

    someone said gamers have been fooled by the wii. i think the opposite is true. many self crowned hardcore gamers have been fooled by their own egos, sony and ms’s pseudocool marketing and gaming forum internet teen and twen gamesfans blabla. they have lost touch to what makes a great game imo. the wii is a great console, not only for kids and moms. people think it is uncool, it is not hd, it doesnt have a hardcore controller, theres no online….sure. but what matters most is great games. wii had them, ds as well, 3ds is an insaneley awesome device. if games arent enough for you, if you want to buy into an image, ask yourself why. dont blame nintendo. they still deliver top quality games like they always did, nothing wrong with that….but you are afraid of enjoying kirby….hmmm. why exactly?

    #42 12 months ago
  43. Digital Bamboo

    What a thread. Didn’t read it all, to be honest, just wanted to ask theevilaires something since I found his comment more than a little contradictory.

    @theevilaires You thought the Wii was a piece of shit (I think you made that much clear), so you decided to double-down and buy 2 Wii U’s at launch–have I got that part right?

    Now, you feel the U is a POS all over again, so you plan on pirating the shit out of Nintendo software as payback to Nintendo–I think that’s accurate as well.

    What I’m curious of, is just what software you plan on pirating? You hate the Wii/U, and believe they have “nothing” to offer, so what are you so eager to play?

    #43 12 months ago
  44. NeutralBlade

    @39 I have nothing to do with the rest of the thread, just giving my thoughts on the matter. If Nintendo owns or have permanent exclusive rights to a product, it’s owned by them. For example, Capcom developed some Zelda games for Nintendo, (which is a 3rd party, not even 2nd), but yet, it’s still a Nintendo product. I think you fail to understand the reason behind my statement. And there’s no denying what a second party’s role is, as they don’t have the same flexibility of a third-party company.

    If second parties were owners of the product behind a company’s banner, then companies like Rare and Bungie would have took said IP with them when the contract ended; they kept what was actually theirs, and moved on. Even if an IP is initially developed and owned, if a company like Nintendo buys the product, it’s no longer the property of the second party. But when the second parties left, the big IPs stayed and was developed by another. There’s no argument to be had about that. Simply put, developing a product doesn’t necessarily mean you own it, but buying a product or the developer itself, does indeed mean you own it. But again, I’m just stating the obvious.

    I haven’t owned a Nintendo console since the GCN days, though I will probably support them in the future. If you have facts, feel free to post them as I don’t mind being corrected. But just saying something isn’t correct, (under the assumption of fanboyism), doesn’t fly with me.

    @40 That’s like stating the obvious. Every company faces their own challenges, and the Wii U position in terms of technical power, is very similar to that of the Wii’s. Nintendo is feeling the pressure from media and investors, but they have a good product to build upon. I don’t see gamers abandoning them once the next-gen systems come out.

    Seeing as I’m a PC gamer, and one that has owned consoles from all three companies, I don’t really sit on any side of the fence, just stating the obvious, which is that Nintendo will recover and do well. Their demise is all I’ve heard since the “Genesis Does” days, and yet, Nintendo is still here. They turned the 3DS around in dominating fashion. It’s a fact that when the GCN sat in 3rd place, Nintendo made a constant profit, regardless of being shunned by 3rd parties, while Microsoft and Sony constantly lost money.

    Nintendo will perform fine regardless of their position next-gen, as they built their product around more than needing to be the best to profit, but being a financially sound plan to make profits. Sony struggled a lot financially this gen, while Nintendo just cruised along. It’s best for everyone that they remained in the game, and their biggest challenge is restoring the confidence of publishers.

    Good games take time, and I say let Nintendo do their thing.

    #44 12 months ago
  45. theevilaires

    @43 I’m gonna pirate mostly the rest of the Wii first party stuff that I can’t find on disk like Zelda Twilight Princess and mario Galaxy and by disk I mean the original copies not the player choice ones. I don’t like greatest hits anything.

    Then I’m gonna pirate 3rd party Wii U games like Batman AC because I already have it for PS3. I’ll probably pirate about $5000 worth of games until I feel satisfied I got my time and money back worth for Nintendos incompetence.

    …does that answer your question sir?

    #45 12 months ago
  46. Clupula

    @44 – It may be been seen as stating the obvious, but obviously, there are some people in this thread that do not adhere to it. This is a thread, plain and simple, about first party development. Not second party development. If Mistwalker make a game for the Wii U and it is published by Nintendo, it is still a second party title.

    The fact that people are trying to blur the lines of definition is dismaying to see.

    Even though I vehemently disagree with many of your predictions for the other systems, even you do not deny the difference between first and second party developers…unlike a certain whipping boy I could mention.

    #46 12 months ago
  47. Dragon246

    @44,
    “It’s a fact that when the GCN sat in 3rd place, Nintendo made a constant profit”
    You know, no one knows about this, since Ninty could have easily buried GC figures in GBA profits.
    Fact remains, hiroshi yamauchi retired due to GC. That tells a lot.

    And what Clupula said.

    #47 12 months ago
  48. NeutralBlade

    @46 Yes, I agree with your statement. Anything a second-party makes is indeed second-party, unless the rights to the IP are sold or initially owned by another.

    To speak on it directly, I think the next-gen consoles will do just fine, and I’ll eventually own them both, along with the Wii U. Initial interest will be good, but then soon after, there will be slow period of growth which will give Nintendo a chance to catch up.

    Nintendo essentially carried the GCN on their own, and could do the same with the Wii U if necessary. But with the extended console life-cycles, and due to so many gaming platforms nowadays, it’s important for them to maintain third-party support, so if they can position their console as a good alternative to next-gen, then they will pull in a healthy profit once manufacturing costs are cheaper.

    Once Nintendo readies their big IP, I think the wise thing to do would be to slash their console prices to $250 and $300, so it will compete directly with the $300 sub 720 while not requiring a sub fee. When you look at their situation, it’s not much different from this gen. People thought they would be destroyed by the much stronger consoles, but yet, they did just fine.

    It will cost a lot to develop for next-gen, which developing for the current-gen and the Wii U will be remain attractive to companies for while now. Other companies along with Nintendo have talked about what it takes to profit from games these days. The challenge will be greater for next-gen, though the x86 platforms will reduce costs to a certain extent. I’m hoping the increased costs don’t equate to $70 games, but nothing is official at the moment.

    Next-gen has a bumpy road ahead, and if Nintendo sells enough consoles, they will end up in a position where it just makes sense for developers to release games on it. If Nintendo becomes the safe bet, we’ll see healthy support and a long life for the Wii U.

    But it remains to be seen on what occurs.

    @47 I followed the market back then, and it’s been reported multiple times, on what I stated during that generation. Stories surrounding the cost to manufacture consoles, who was in the red or black, and who came out the best financially, regardless of their position in the console wars.

    It’s just that these days, it seems like you have to be the best to survive, and it seems even more so, moving into next-gen. Nintendo could have made a more powerful console, but they chose to focus on the experience, and of course to manufacture a product where reaching a profit margin in manufacturing, is easy to reach.

    In the case of the Wii U, Nintendo made a profit as long as one game was sold per console, from launch. They have room to take a loss and slash the Wii U packages by $50 if necessary, as it wouldn’t take too long for manufacturing costs to lower to the point of recovery; which a similar situation occurred with the 3DS.

    I’m interested in the data on the next-gen consoles as well, as it will reveal just how long it will be before M&S can actually make any sort of profit on their new systems. That’s a goal that they struggled to reach both this and last gen, but we’ll see how it shapes up in the future.

    #48 12 months ago
  49. Joe Musashi

    @48 “Anything a second-party makes is indeed second-party, unless the rights to the IP are sold or initially owned by another.”

    Which makes no impact whatsoever on who developed the title. Which was the crux of the discussion – before the goalposts were moved.

    JM

    #49 12 months ago
  50. Dragon246

    @48,
    I would like to have a debate with you on this since you are nice enough to give counterpoints without insults but right now I am a bit busy. Even I think WiiU is profitable now , especially after the devaluation of yen. But they have almost hamstrung their ability with (probably) too much expected operational profit . I suggest you read their annual report along with investor Q/A, it doesn’t make for a good reading.

    #50 12 months ago
  51. NeutralBlade

    @50 I’ve read a some things surrounding those reports, but nothing in great detail. I’ll check them out sometime soon. Thanks for your suggestion.

    #51 12 months ago