Releasing a game demo can cut your sales in half, warns Schell

Or, you know, they’ll pirate the thing and then have the whole game and never bother buying it at all.

Surely if the demo was good and the game was good then the demo would increase sales?

So don’t they mean shit demos for shit games cut sales in half?

Oh yeah, a demo can cut your sales in half… particularly if it is BAD, or if your game is bad.

Schell’s comments are quite shocking to me because he only speaks in term of sales, not quality AT ALL (and when you see the games his company has released, I am not surprised).

60 euros/dollars/whatever is a lot of money to pay “blindly”. You have to know if the game is going to be good or if it will suits your taste. Being gamers don’t mean we HAVE to buy any game that is released.

I’ve NEVER seen any gamer try a demo and say “oh boy, this is so fun/good… let’s not buy it”. The only cases where it happens are when the demo is bad. And by “the demo is bad” I mean either that
1- the game in itself is bad OR
2- the demo didn’t represent the game’s qualities (so the demo should have been better made or they should have scrapped the whole idea of a demo).

There are games where a demo isn’t worth it. Games like Demon’s/Dark Souls for instance. But for most cases it IS a useful tool for a gamer to make his decision. Last examples I had on this were Metal Gear Rising Revengeance and DmC. I had a blast with MGRR’s demo and pre-ordered the collector’s edition, where I honestly tried DmC and it was not fun to ME.
Same went with Ni no Kuni: I was quite interested in the game, but trying the demo REALLY confirmed my interest and also made me buy the collector’s edition

Wasn’t the Bayonetta demo shit? If so, that’s mad as it’s the only game I’ve given 10/10 this gen.

Thankfully I don’t have to give scores any more though.

i make it a policy to never buy a retail game unless it has a demo. if it never gets one, i might try renting it, but if i rent it and enjoy it, why would i go out and buy it? surely i can just beat it during my rental!

To conclude that people should have to pay top dollar for a game they may not particularly like shows real contempt for the customer.

You know, I rarely buy a game unless it does have a demo, so I’m not sure how I fit into their sales ideals. Look at the Traveller’s Tales LEGO games, for example; those always have demos, and apparently they sell really well.

Perhaps the truth here is that a demo reveals to the masses how terrible your game is, regardless of the marketing involved. So, quite simply, put effort into not making crap games?

@6: That’s why I don’t buy much in the way of mainstream any more.

Well, now that’s a nice way to treat your customers like idiots. This statement is wrong on so many lvls, it’s incredible. He’s basically saying, that all that matters is to sell you stuff, even if it’s a piece of shit. Ppl won’t buy a game without a demo. They’ll rent it. Or get it from a friend. Or pirate it. Moron.

I didn’t think the Bayonetta demo was shit. Short, yes, but not bad. It convinced me to get the game, when I was on the fence about it. I don’t want to make this another thread about that OTHER game, but I’ll say the demo for that one confirmed everything I thought was going to be wrong with it.

On the other hand, Brutal Legend…always HATED Jack Black. Find him so incredibly unfunny and I’ve always felt his whole “metal” thing devalues the genre, so the last thing I wanted to do was play a game with Jack Black in the world of metal. Sounds like the lamest concept on earth. The demo made me buy it first day.

A good demo can help your sales. A bad demo will wreck them.

One more thing! Another problem with demos is that they sometimes pick the least interesting parts of games, or they’d horribly disjointed. The best way to handle a demo is to just give the first hour of the game, without it being all over the place and incomplete.

Work with Valve on creating a new form of DRM that allows an hour’s play of a game for free before having to buy it. Plenty, and I mean plenty, of casual developers use this exact system to sell their games! The only reason I bought the first of the Drawn games was because I played the timed trial and enjoyed it so much that I didn’t want to put it down when the time ran out.

This kind of thing would work for mainstream games, too. It doesn’t have to be a specifically cut up demo (at least not on the PC). All they have to do is just allow for an hour’s trial. Is that so hard?

So, what games does this guy’s company make, so I know to eternally avoid them? Since I’ve never heard of him before, I’m guessing they’re PC titles?

@8:

I second that.
Since after The Witcher 2, all my money for games went to indie devs. I just despise so many parts of mainstream development…
Which is really a shame because there would be great games, made by great artists. But they (and the consumers) really need to fire the leadership and make sure that it is replaced by one that aspires to MUCH higher moral standards.

@11 : that might not be a bad idea (but just as the demo, the beginning of the game must be good or interesting enough so that people want to do more).
On PS+ (Sony’s paying version of the PSN), you can try many games for one hour. After that the game can’t be launched (unless you buy it). It’s quite good. Tried Borderlands like that and quite like it.

So it IS technically possible to do that for all games. The problem might lie with the bandwidth: for such free 1 hour trial, you need to download the full game (different size than a 3 Go demo)

@14: It’s not only on PS+. I’m not a member and it worked for several different indie games I’ve tried, like Quantum Conundrum and Pixel Junk’s Eden. You download the game and after the time’s up, you can buy a key to unlock the rest. I’d still rather prefer a demo for bigger titles though. Not really looking forward to downloading a huge game just to see, that it’s was a huge waste of time.

@15: I know it’s possible for small games as well, but I was talking about “big” games

I have never bought a game I’m not sure about just to see if it’s any good. I have frequently bought games I knew nothing about after playing good demo versions of them. Personal conclusion: This guy is full of shit.

@17 +1

If I don’t get a demo, I’m not going to buy your game at full price just to see if I like it.

I’ll watch a walkthrough for a few chapters on Youtube and make up my mind then.

I just had a blast playing through a borrowed copy of WH40K: Space Marine over the weekend. I’d had every intention of buying the game at launch, but the demo put me off. So that’s one wasted sale.

Same goes for DmC – if there hadn’t been a demo, I’d have bought it day one; but I didn’t like the controls in the demo so I didn’t and still haven’t. Another sale lost.

That said, I’d have never picked up Star Wars: The Force Unleashed if it wasn’t for its *awesome* demo, so horses for courses I suppose.

They do cost a helluva lost of time/money to make though, so I can see why Jesse Schell thinks they’re not really worth it on balance.

Either the game can stand on its own strength, and carries the backing and belief of the people that made it – and if proven it, is worth buying…Or, it doesn’t have those qualities, and it needs me to hold reservation, or be more cautious. The problem for publishers, there, is that game can find itself rejected for another that left me with a simpler choice.

If the publisher isn’t visibly behind a game (especially so, where impression/info has been thin on the ground – and they now insist on meting that out piecemeal like it’s rations!) then BY NO MEANS should you ask somebody to plunge their money in to the grab-bag and hope to get something worthwhile!

@19 – You thought the demo for The Force Unleashed was good? That’s actually what turned me off to it. The QTE AT-AT fight. I was enjoying it up until it suddenly felt like I didn’t really fight anything.

Call me old school but i dont play demos, the few i did play gave me a bad taste of the games thinking they were bad, and then after buying the games i realize the games were good or great, which made me realize that for various reasons, from being badly made by developers, etc, demos doesnt work, i think they are too short to give a good glimpse of the final complete game.

But i do understand and respect that people use it as a main criteria for their purchases, though.

I wasn’t planning to buy Sleeping Dogs till I played the demo. Same goes with Call of Juarez 2, Crysis , Killzone and a li others.

It is a double edged sword. If your game is really good then you don’t have to worry.

I’m gonna repeat here what i wrote in the latest UK Charts thread:

“Just proves to me that if anyone is interested in sales, should abandon demos. I’d argue (and some vg247 users have confirmed that) that DMC sold less units because most people thought they’ve seen it all with the Demo. Same goes for DS3. The full version is like a completely different game.

The game that seems to be suffering from it the most from the demo release is Spec Ops – The Line. A game which didn’t even get started until Chapter 9 or so.”

An interesting video:

http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/demo-daze

Funny that, because just this weekend I purchased Sonic Racing Transformed purely because I enjoyed the demo. Wouldn’t of touched it without demo’ing first, and ended up spending 9 hours glued to it Sat and Sun.

Lol, welcome to the future of gaming.

You can`t sell your games.

You can`t buy used games.

You can`t try a demo.

The developers decide the price, availability and version.

You get to pay full price for “digital convenience”.

Your experience is enhanced with paying for various subscriptions.

Micro-transactions and pay to win schemes.

Always online.

Etc…

I can`t wait to experience the future… ><

It’s the case, lately, that I go on the streaming/VOD channel of somebody showing gameplay impressions, and from that I can see that game looks fun – and I (usually) hadn’t considered getting it before seeing it – but, because I can see it in action, it looks good, that situation’s likely to lead to enthusiasm and purchases.

But, that was only necessary to happen because the publisher was reluctant to present their game in the first place.
I can see the view about demo = less sales. The figures for that are common knowledge.
But, people are not doing enough to inform after understanding that they are not offering a demo, so need to do more.
If the publisher was doing enough to push their game, then I wouldn’t have to resort to finding these so often, to try to understand the quality of what’s on offer, vs the noise surrounding it.

@25: It’s wouldn’t HAVE. Wouldn’t OF doesn’t make sense.

@28: That’s your issue? A grammatical error and the police are out. Surely your username doesn’t make sense then either? lol

releasing a *bad game demo will cut your game sales in half
releasing a demo whereas the gameplay is totally different to what player had in mind will cut game sales.

I think the only demo that completly destroyed my interest in a game was Dragon Age 2. After completing the small section I knew that the gameplay had been changed too much and would probably make me sell the game before I ever finished it.

@29: It makes me mad. I often see people do that and assume it’s the right way to write and I’ve been doing it wrong all the time. But it isn’t, so stop doing that, you’re just confusing foreigners.

@32: You know, I tend to avoid online gaming forums because frankly many “gamers” act like obnoxious little shits once they have some anonymity and no real possibility of accountability. However, after lurking on this site since it first appeared I thought I’d take a chance and jump in. First post and it’s the Grammar Police. Incredible.

Would you of jumped into an overheard conversation in a pub and said, “Excuse me old bean but your use of the Queen’s English is incorrect, best sort it out less The Foreigners get the wrong idea!” I’m guessing not.

Welcome to Disneyland MattW

I think, if people watch that video, you’ll see that there is no contempt or spite. Gamers are very quick to anger.

I’ve always maintained that curiosity plays a large part in game sales. People generally want to sample the game and often make a purchase partially driven by this desire. If that curiosity is sated by a game’s demo then that sale may not occur – as the analysis presented clearly shows. Games with trailers but no demos garnered far more commercial success than games with demos.

This isn’t about disrespecting anyone. This is looking at how customers behave, observing trends and responding accordingly.

JM

@33: That should be “lest”, not “less”.

Sort it the fuck out, mate.

@33: Would I HAVE jumped into an overheard conversation in a pub? No. But this isn’t a pub, this is an internet forum, everybody is free to talk. And everybody can reply to you.

You could’ve simply taken the comment lightly – the way it was meant to be – but instead you choose to be offended.

That was not my intention, but you should definitely lighten up.

On topic: I bought plenty of games because of their demos. But one thing makes sense for shure: bad demos don’t work in favour of a game.

lol ok and I’m off before I even begun I operate by Pub Rules – talk to people on the internet as I would in real life. Not wasting my time, sorry fellas. Rather than discuss the matter at hand, posters shouldn’t have to worry about minor grammatical errors being picked up by little shits looking to score some cheap points. Well look at you, aren’t you sooooo clever!

As I said, Pub Rules – you talk to people like that in a pub you better be able to back it up

Have fun

Look at you, talking all tough behind a monitor, bet you wouldn’t be talking like that in a pub.

Anyway, I scored by pointing out his grammatical errors.

U-S-A!
U-S-A!
U-S-A!
U-S-A!

Which points btw.?

@2 Or shit demos for good games.

I held off on buying Just Cause 2 because the demo was terribly optimized.

Then I eventually got it for cheap during a sale, and the game itself worked just fine, and I would’ve happily paid full price for it.

I think the inconvenient truth is that you could be just as damned if you do, than if you don’t.

I’ve played plenty of really good games with demos that weren’t any good. So he has a point.

However, getting to start to play the game and then simply pay in-game to continue would be great. And I Think releasing episode 1 of Alan Wake for free would have done wonders for that title. Even releasing it as an episodic title would’ve been great.

@24

I like Spec-Ops: The Line, but I’d be the first to say that they were the victims of their own poor development ethos. There was a lot of padding involved before getting to the meat of the matter. If part 9 had been part 2, then a demo would have shown that the game was worth playing.

What the demo instead showed was that the game had a lot of padding. The adage continues to be true: Make better games, and your demos won’t betray you.

Translation -

“Don’t let them know that your product is half-hearted shit, otherwise they won’t by it.”

@22: Actually, you’re Nu School (as is the current vernacular with the kids, I think). Old school is shareware and demos. If you look at the ancient home computers, and even the early days of the IBM PC, there were demos and shareware everywhere. Cover tapes, et al.

@44: That should be “buy” not “by”.

Seriously pal, sort your life out.

@14

Yeah. That’s a fair point. You’re clearly an intelligent person and I won’t argue with you on that point at all. I would however say though that that’s even more of an encouragement to buy the game. See, you have the entire game locally, now. All you have to do is pay to unlock it.

Whereas if you’ve just played a chopped up demo and you were on the seat, needing to download another 20gb might actually be the element that tips you towards just not bothering.

Another successfull game maker, and by “successfull” I mean he made stuff like a Pirates of the Caribbean ride at the Walt Disney’s World Resort, a Pirates of the Caribbean MMO, a Disneyland meet and greet attraction and Toontown Online, tries to teach the Industry what sells and what doesn’t.

Were there even remotely meaningful events at DICE this year?

The guy talking sounds like a sneaky thief!

You can’t expect people to dish out 59.99€ or more recently 69.99€ for a game, especially if you don’t have a proven track record, without giving them a chance to try it out first. And beside that, I don’t think I have ever played a demo that has put me off from buying a game that I had been looking forward to. On the contrary, there are plenty of games that i never considered buying had I not played the demo. Games like XCOM: Enemy Unkown, inFAMOUS, Just Cause 2 Batman: Arkham Asylum, Deus Ex: Human Revolution (leaked preview version), Fight Night Champion, Diablo III and skate. just to name some – all of which I ended up buying. And in most cases, sequels or DLC to those games.

I try out demos for plenty of games I don’t like or have interest in just to see if I missed something. I wasn’t looking forward to Dead Space 3, but I gave the demo a go. Nothing changed. They didn’t lose a pre-order, they didn’t get one because I just didn’t find it much fun and I didn’t get burned. Demos for DmC, Metal Gear Rising and Dragon’s Dogma got me on the fence, and I’m considering picking each one of those up once they receive a discount. Again, games that I previously had no interest in. Games that I didn’t follow or had mixed feelings about.