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Windows 8 sales ‘below internal projections’, source claims

Monday, 19 November 2012 17:10 GMT By Dave Cook

Windows 8 sales have been called ‘disappointing’ by Microsoft, according to an alleged tipster who has also suggested that sales of the operating system are below company projections. Get the details below.

Gamespot reports – by way of Paul Thurrott’s Supersite for Windows – that one of Thurrott’s trusted sources inside Microsoft has shed light on the company’s reaction to sales of the operating system so far.

Thurrott writes in an account of his source’s claim, “Sales of Windows 8 PCs are well below Microsoft’s internal projections and have been described inside the company as disappointing. But here’s the catch: The software giant blames the slow start on lackluster PC maker designs and availability, further justifying its new Surface strategy.”

The source claimed that Microsoft cites PC maker’s “inability to deliver,” as a key reason for the poor sales of Windows 8, and again underlines the company’s move into making its own bespoke tablet hardware.

It comes as some game developers have waxed lyrical on the subject of Windows 8′s closed platform, including Introversion’s Chris Delay who went so far as to say that Microsoft has ‘Apple envy’.

Serious Sam developer Alen Ladavac also waded into the debate heavily on the Steam forums, stating, “If it was just about ‘being downloaded from Windows store’, it would not be a problem. It would be nice to have a common hub to download things from. But to get an app onto that store, it has to be certified by Microsoft.”

What’s your take on Windows 8? Is this poor sell-through just a result of this being a costly time of year, or is the operating system in danger of being in real trouble? Let us know below.

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82 Comments

  1. The Auracle

    Personally, I really like the new operating system. Of all OS’s out-and-about, MS has got the most unique and innovative one going. Certain figures in gaming – particularly Gabe Newell – have been getting all uppity about the fact there is now a Windows Store alongside The App Store (Apple) but that’s masking the truth: they don’t want competition in the likes of Microsoft AND Apple, as that might put a dent in their quarterly reports.

    But there should be no beef about games being played on a Windows 8 machine. You can still do all the things you’re used to as Microsoft has quite clearly made backwards compatibility a top priority when using the new OS. Yes, the GUI (Metro) is an acquired taste and some might argue that the learning curve is a bit steep but once you’re comfortable with it, you’re flying around in no time.

    In all honesty, I can’t knock an OS that allows me to play games and tweet at same time. That’s no exaggeration, by the way. Multi-tasking on Windows 8 is quite impressive.

    #1 2 years ago
  2. Dave Cook

    @1 I think few people can argue with you there :) Great post. I don’t blame MS for closing off a corner of the market for themselves in these volatile times where content control and delivery is king. Can;t be easy up at the top trying to second guess such a malleable industry. I wouldn’t want their job.

    #2 2 years ago
  3. Lord Gremlin

    It’s simple. Why windows is chosen? We have free Linux, Mac OS… BUT only windows is open, compatible with old windows stuff and has Start menu with it’s convenient navigation of program icons.
    Now, Win 8 has no start menu, it’s openness in questionable and it’s not compatible with a lot of old windows stuff.
    I will not use Win 8, that’s for sure. I’m still using XP – I normally play on PS3/Vita and have no reason to use even Win 7.

    #3 2 years ago
  4. freedoms_stain

    Despite being even cheaper than what I paid for Windows (~£25 vs ~£40-50) Microsoft haven’t really demonstrated any particular reason to bother upgrading.

    Give us decent multi-display features and the ability to send audio from different sources to different audio devices and I’ll buy it right fucking now. A new start bar and some minor performance improvements aren’t really selling points for me.

    #4 2 years ago
  5. Ireland Michael

    Windows 9, coming 2014, now with Start Menu!

    #5 2 years ago
  6. dizzygear

    The lack of the start menu, how Aero glass was replaced by a theme that looks like Steams inbred cousin and how it tries to force metro down your throat even though it works like ass on a desktop machine is why its not selling. Of course they rather commit suicide than to admit that…

    The only reason i have not uninstalled it is because of Ex7forW8 and that Windows 8 finally fixes the infuriatingly annoying HDMI overscan bug that plagued intel graphic adapters.

    #6 2 years ago
  7. G1GAHURTZ

    I think Win8 will take a while to take off, anyway.

    People are probably waiting to get a touch screen device, before getting a copy.

    #7 2 years ago
  8. Tech-N9ne

    @3 What u mean by “it’s not compatible with a lot of old windows stuff”?

    You guys keep spreading false info. Anything you can install on Windows 7 you can on Windows 8.

    #8 2 years ago
  9. NiceFellow

    I wouldn’t be surprised if this was true. The update seems too little for existing PC owners to get particularly excited about and the market-share on tablet is still small for the OS.

    I’ve no doubt it’ll pick up but I think Win8 is going to have to rely on new PC purchases rather than people upgrading for quite a while. The metro UI while very nice on a tablet is more of a nuisance on PC too which is garnering the release a bit of negativity from the existing install base as well.

    It’ll still be selling bucket loads of course, just smaller bucket loads than it might have had it been more focused on existing owners.

    #9 2 years ago
  10. Edo

    That tablet strategy biting them in the ass…who knew…

    #10 2 years ago
  11. Da Man

    Why I always hated Windows? it’s simple: Start Menu, with it’s backwards design and idiotic way of navigating programs shortcuts. Amongst other annoyances ofc.

    Now with Win8 I might change my mind, but only a little bit.

    #11 2 years ago
  12. alimokrane

    Still using Windows XP Professional here and I dont intend to upgrade anytime soon. My 360 provides all my gaming needs.

    #12 2 years ago
  13. AmiralPatate

    This is hardly surprising. I guess you’d have to a Microsoft executive to actually think it was a genius move.

    #13 2 years ago
  14. GrimRita

    I purchased Win 8 to go on my new SSD drive. I wasn’t planning on getting Win 8 but the offer on MS website – £25, was too good to turn down.

    Takes some getting used to and removing all the shitty Bing crap and replacing it with google and you’re set.

    I like it. Not problems with games or software working. Which is always an issue.

    #14 2 years ago
  15. Bomba Luigi

    I have nothing against Win8, The Problem it has is Win7. Why should I change to Win8? I see no Reason, Win7 just doing fine as ever.

    #15 2 years ago
  16. DSB

    @15 Exactly, why would I need Windows 8?

    Microsoft are floundering. They’ve pretty much sold Nokia down the river with Windows Phone, and this was supposed to be their “all things to all people” system, which made everything right again.

    Unless the mobile platforms pull it back up though, they’ll be hard pressed to explain why this was a good idea.

    #16 2 years ago
  17. Erthazus

    Windows 7 is really good to upgrado to Windows 8.

    Windows 8 is nothing special compared to Windows 7 to be honest. Windows 8 does not even have Direct X12.

    So gamers have no reason to upgrade or casual users.

    #17 2 years ago
  18. Maximum Payne

    I think their logic was : windows 7 is great and everybody is using it , now lets experiment ?!
    I really thought after 7 each new windows will be best option in every way…

    #18 2 years ago
  19. Wertisdk

    I bought Windows 8 for developing Windows 8 apps, trying it out and testing our software before the customers started using it.

    I have two major issues.

    1. I don’t mind the new Metro UI and it’s options / extra menus. In fact I like the design and the concept. It’s just so unintuitive to access! I mean, who on earth would know that putting your cursor in the lower right bottom of the screen would open up a menu that let’s you access the start button and SHUT DOWN YOUR COMPUTER? They could at least have but some better visual cue that indicated what was there. I’d also like a start button where it used to be, that opened the Metro UI, since there’s no logical way to access the Metro UI from the desktop.

    2. Why the hell won’t they let me buy their software? Uppgrade? UPGRADE!? No I need a full version, so I can do a clean install. The website is ridiculously vague on the point of it being only an upgrade from a previous already installed version. You can even make a clean install USB-pen (thanks) and an ISO. BUT YOU CANNOT ACTIVATE THAT.
    Seriously. I wrote the local Microsoft store, since they had a link, and they didn’t know anything. Then I called Microsoft, yes CALLED, since they have no mail support, after I had already purchased Windows 8 Pro (which by the way don’t mention it’s an upgrade-only version on the receipt), just to get a vague “I’m sorry but you have bought the upgrade only version, and I cannot tell you how to buy the full version. Contact your local retailer”.

    So I wasted a small amount of money, that’s fine, but I get really angry and frustrated by their lack of communication, or rather cleverly crafted communication that tries to predict what the user wants instead of just making it clear.

    You know that kind of insult to the user, claiming that you are clearly not intelligent enough to understand what we write, way. It’s the same with some of their new design ideas. It reeks of being carefully designed to make you not think, but ends up being frustrating, because there’s no good reason to prevent the user from doing something AND having a simple and intuitive interface, where all the advanced stuff is hidden away…


    Sorry for the rant…
    But I feel it’s a growing trend. Netflix does it, Apple does it, Facebook does it, HBO does it, Amazon does it – 1) Prevent me from buying stuff I want to pay for. 2) Trying to make magical AI predictions, ends up frustrating me by hiding close to all options.

    #19 2 years ago
  20. apollyonbob

    @19 You have to buy the OEM version to do a clean install. Newegg sells them. I realize it’s too late now, but that’s how you get the clean install version. Note that it’s a different license. It’s referred to as the “System Builder’s Version” or Newegg just calls it Full-OEM http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832416552

    Although interestingly, I notice that the T&C for it said that, basically, “If you’re buying this for yourself, you’re still subject to the T&C for the personal license” … Whatever the hell that means haha.

    #20 2 years ago
  21. laughing-gravy

    I’m not surprised it’s failing. Many desktops and laptops don’t even have touch screens which this OS seems to be designed for. Corporate customers are also up in arms about having to use touch screen functions to access menu’s etc. It may have been better if it were just for tablets but it isn’t. Even sales of Surface are as Steve Ballmer puts it ‘modest’, which is corporate speak for disastrous. If you want a picture of just how well Microsoft are doing lately I’ll put a link to an article below.
    http://semiaccurate.com/2012/11/14/microsoft-has-failed/

    #21 2 years ago
  22. apollyonbob

    @19 Oh, also, pro-tip … The new Windows 8 UI relies on hardware in a way that it hasn’t in the past. Don’t use the mouse to get to the Start Screen, hit the Start Key. Don’t use the mouse to get to the Settings bar, hit Windows+I.

    But hell, don’t use the software to shut down at all. Hit the power button. I’m not kidding. On every machine from about … 10 years ago now, the power button does not just turn off the machine. It actually sends a signal to the OS to begin the shutdown process.

    By default, it goes into some kind of crazy low power sleep mode. Your machine appears to power off, turns off all LEDs and fans, but when you hit the power button again, it flicks on in about 2 seconds with no POST.

    So it’s not OFF off, but it’s off. Haven’t quite figured that one out yet, but damn if it doesn’t work great. It’s awesome to hit the power button on your machine and have it “boot up” instantly.

    #22 2 years ago
  23. Da Man

    People still using mouse with their PCs? Wow.

    #23 2 years ago
  24. Wertisdk

    @20 Thanks for the tip – it’s not really too late, well not in any other sense that I am already negatively biased towards it now.
    But yeah, that’s the point really. Being so bad at communicating, that I gave up on finding the clean-install version…
    1) I’ve been piecing together the last 5 PC’s I’ve had, so I have never had an OEM Windows, except for my laptops
    2) Running Windows 8 in a VM, really isn’t that far-fetched. Do they expect me to do a clean Windows 7 install BEFORE I can install Windows 8? That’s intuitive…

    @22 Yeah it’s amazing man! I had to google the thing you described, and apparently there’s these things called “shortcuts” which magically does something based on a key combination. This is quite a discovery!
    Seriously though – I’m all for shortcuts and all; I’d even go out on a leg here, and say that I use quite a bit more shortcuts than the average user. But this is just a strange decision, forcing the user to rely on shortcuts you do not get presented or am able to look up.

    #24 2 years ago
  25. roadkill

    Screw 8! No Start menu, no Aero and Metro doesn’t work on PCs. I’ll stick with 7. And as soon as Gabe and friends start doing something cool for Linux I’m switching to that. I never knew that Ubuntu is so easy to use.

    #25 2 years ago
  26. woe

    This rumor is days old.

    #26 2 years ago
  27. apollyonbob

    @24 It’s strange to hear this sass from someone who just wrote “since there’s no logical way to access the Metro UI from the desktop” when there is a dedicated hardware key with a giant icon on it for just that. A dedicated hardware key that has been there for approximately fifteen years.

    I mean, it’s just, I would expect less sass, Mr Sassmouth. :P

    #27 2 years ago
  28. Mike W

    This isn’t vista all over again is it?

    #28 2 years ago
  29. The_Deleted

    I want Vista back so Ican get back to ROME: Total War!

    #29 2 years ago
  30. Ireland Michael

    @28 This happens almost on clockwork since Microsoft’s inception.

    Bad OS.
    Great OS.
    Bad OS.
    Great OS.

    #30 2 years ago
  31. Hunam

    People saying that anything you can install in windows 7 installs in windows 8 is technically true… but it doesn’t mean it’ll work :P

    With the whole steam hating it is because it’s a first step. The idea is that Metro will one day be the only form of the OS (maybe in 9) and the only way to be a metro tile UI is to be from windows store… which requires certification and vague, arbitrary rules. Basically, steam are rightly worried that one day MS wont just make it hard for them to compete, they’ll cut them off entirely.

    #31 2 years ago
  32. Erthazus

    This is not Vista. Vista was broken as F-bomb.

    Windows 8 is Windows 7.5 with new UI and App store. It’s not bad, it’s not great or good or meh. It’s Okay.

    There is no Direct X12 or something completely new that pushes PC hardware to it’s limits but at the same time it works and it’s not power hungry compared to Windows 7. Not all of the programs work correctly for now. It’s decent.

    but I will stay on Windows 7 until Microsoft will release Direct X12 for something.

    #32 2 years ago
  33. Stardog

    @7 Except touch screen devices use Windows RT, not proper Windows 8.

    PC is not going the way of touch-screen monitors. That’s what tablets are for (hello to my Nexus 7).

    They’ve put a tablet OS on desktop and it’s failing miserably.

    Microsoft are a failure of a company. They pretty much own PC’s, yet have failed to capitalize on all of those users.

    All they had to do was create an “MS App Store” application where people could upload any app they wanted. MS would’ve made billions by now doing this over the last 10 years. Now, when they eventually do it, it’s on lockdown and every app has to be certified. They’re idiots.

    #33 2 years ago
  34. fearmonkey

    Great!! I hope it continues to be slow, as it might give MS a freaking clue that consumers like choices, and taking away the start menu and saying you cant have it was a bad idea. Seriously, I have Windows 8 as I have new PC and i got it for the $15 download, but I never use it. The machine is dual booted with Windows 8/Windows 7 and I always use Windows 7.

    If they would have allowed the start menu as an option, I would have made that my primary OS, but since I don’t have a large touchscreen monitor, the lack of a start menu turns me off greatly.

    #34 2 years ago
  35. G1GAHURTZ

    @33:

    There are loads of Win8 Pro tablets. Just look. At the ASUS TAICHI, for example. http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/laptop/3407948/asus-taichi-ultrabook-hands-on-review/

    You can also expect just about every new monitor made in 2013 to be touch, as well.

    Like it or not, the future of the desktop is an all-in-one touch screen, anyway.

    #35 2 years ago
  36. GwynbleiddiuM

    The OS itself isn’t the issue, IMO, it’s the direction that Microsoft’s headed. When you close the doors, it’ll be hard to get in. That’s the issue. Not the lack of start menu or adding metro. I’m very confident at its core Win 8 is not what Vista was, a train wreck when first it was out. Firstly, Microsoft released Win 8 for the market that wasn’t in need of a new OS, then they went to build up new policies, closing the platform. It’s not something they hoped to achieve with Win 8, but it was certainly the foundation, the shape of things to come. Honestly, I for one didn’t need a new OS, I was more than happy with 7.

    Though Win 8 still can have a great competition in Smartphone/tablet market. Had a hands on a few Asus win 8 devices and they were impressive, although we were shown a faulty sample of Taichi. But the concept is great.

    #36 2 years ago
  37. CPC_RedDawn

    Windows 8 has sold poorly because of:

    Unpopular design features,
    More restrictive access to OS,
    Stupid Microsoft Shop for apps,
    The color scheme is just… hideous!,

    It is not an upgrade, they should have kept the old start menu and task bar for desktop and pushed this Metro UI for tablets and mobile. Making a better experience for all. I have used W8 since RTM and beta’s in VM and its terrible for desktop use. Most desktop PC’s use mouse and keyboard not a touchscreen. Touchscreen works much better with tablets and smartphones. Microsoft missed out massively on this iteration of W8. They heard all the negative feedback from industry analysts and still they released a crappy OS with nothing new to offer other than an extremely poor UI redesign. They should of looked at the feedback and held back the release date to make vital changes to please their customers. Instead they ignored people’s views, ideas, and complaints and released the worst OS since Windows Millennium!!

    #37 2 years ago
  38. BluegreenDragonfly

    #35 G1gahurtz said, ”
    You can also expect just about every new monitor made in 2013 to be touch, as well.

    Like it or not, the future of the desktop is an all-in-one touch screen, anyway.”

    Can you please tell me where you purchase your crystal balls? I would like to buy a pair as well. Thank you.

    I have no problem whatsoever believing that all of your brainpower could easily be expressed through your index finger. For me, however, its just not possible. Why don’t you go out and buy yourself a nice new tablet and you won’t have to be bothered anymore with such silly archaic input devices like keyboards and mice.

    @ #38 Well said my friend. I like to express Microsofts attitude towards the traditional desktop user in Windows 8 by simply saying that, “they gave us all the middle finger.” And now were giving it back .!..

    I am boycotting Windows 8. I didn’t install the consumer preview and may lightning strike me down if I ever go against my natural instincts and actually purchase and install Windows 8.

    The least I can do is refrain from the Windows 8 catastrophe in protest until at the very least, the next version of Windows is released, which includes an interface that realizes that desktops and tablets are not equals.

    #38 2 years ago
  39. G1GAHURTZ

    ^ You’re clearly some sort of PC newb, who doesn’t seem to understand that an all in one also uses a keyboard and mouse.

    http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/pc-mac-desktops/dell-xps-one-27-touch-1093908/review

    Either that, or you’re just in some sort of geek inspired denial that people would actually want new and improved technology in the future.

    Face it. It’s obvious that the desktop unit will almost certainly end up like the motor enthusiast’s classic car, unwanted by the vast majority, once all in one’s become a bit cheaper.

    #39 2 years ago
  40. Christopher Jack

    I don’t know why so many people are up in arms about W8, took me less than 5 mins to learn all the new features without any assistance & as for the Microsoft store debacle- the only real problem there is about it is that it’s required for the premium looking tiles in the start screen.

    #40 2 years ago
  41. BluegreenDragonfly

    @40 G1GAHURTZ,

    “^ You’re clearly some sort of PC newb, who doesn’t seem to understand that an all in one also uses a keyboard and mouse.

    http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/pc-mac-desktops/dell-xps-one-27-touch-1093908/review

    You seriously didn’t think I already knew that you could still use a keyboard and mouse with Windows 8? LOL. Gee, that was so nice of Microsoft to leave that “old” and “archaic” technology in alongside the “new” and “improved” touch-screen interface technology.

    “Face it. It’s obvious that the desktop unit will almost certainly end up like the motor enthusiast’s classic car, unwanted by the vast majority, once all in one’s become a bit cheaper.”

    LOL. The only thing that’s obvious is that you don’t use a desktop computer for anything but gaming and watching YouTube videos. If you did, you would have the common sense to realize that “touch” interfaces are good for nothing but the simplest of computer tasks and desktops will never be replaced. They are simply one of the most productive means of computing on planet earth. A keyboard and mouse combination are one of the most powerful user input device combinations on planet earth. A touch interface is simply an enhancement to these superior input devices. Anyone who thinks a “touch” interface is a “replacement” for them needs to get some therapy.

    Please, if you don’t get help at Charter, get help somewhere.

    P.S. You still haven’t told me where you purchase your crystal balls. I am dying to know. :)

    #41 2 years ago
  42. Ireland Michael

    @40 “Face it. It’s obvious that the desktop unit will almost certainly end up like the motor enthusiast’s classic car, unwanted by the vast majority, once all in one’s become a bit cheaper.”

    And that’s why an OS that attempts to slot a touch UI on top of a dedicated PC platform basically ended up flopping.

    Tablets are awesome. Mobile devices are cool. Laptops are convenient and useful. But claiming that the desktop is going the way of the dodo is pretty hilarious. PC gaming is absolutely gigantic.

    #42 2 years ago
  43. freedoms_stain

    http://www.explosm.net/db/files/Comics/Kris/complete.png

    #43 2 years ago
  44. G1GAHURTZ

    @42: Are you serious?

    You seem to be having a conversation all by yourself.

    Where did I ever say, or even come close to implying that touch screen controls would replace a m/kb?

    Stop being so hypersensitive and paranoid.

    Yes, a touch screen is an “enhancement” (See, unlike you, I can actually use quotation marks to quote what you actually said, rather than words that you never even typed.) to a m/kb. I never suggested anything different. It’s clear to anyone who’s ever used one on a daily basis, unlike some caveman type characature, such as you’re coming across as, who is petrified of change, that using all three types of input can speed up workflow by huge amounts.

    For instance, I can own a Win8 Pro tablet, dock it at work on a full size monitor, with m/kb, then undock it, keep working on my commute home, with full touch screen controls, and even dock it again at home if I need to.

    If you work in an office on a daily basis, I can almost guarantee you, without ever seeing your monitor, that your screen is covered in smudge marks and fingerprints. Why? Because people have been touching screens for years, without even being able to select/move things around, etc, but now they can.

    Not only that, but there are literally millions upon millions of non-tech minded people who struggle to even use a mouse. Just watch a newb try and do something basic like put the cursor over a link, and see how long it takes them.

    Here is a classic clip, that while obviously not real, is clearly based on real things that non-tech minded people do: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jtIFbCj5ndI

    The future, if tech companies want to reach previously unattainable markets, is clearly on a touch screen device.

    Now, I’m not saying that this means the death of the m/kb. Not by any means. But saying that touch screen technology is somehow bad is so illogical and irrational, that the only one around here who should be seeking professional help, is clearly you.

    A combination of touch, m/kb, stylus, trackball, gamepad, motion control, etc, is what makes PCs so accessible.

    You can still use Win8 with any of the above.

    It’s not some sort of conspiracy to dumb the world down, such as you seem to be implying.

    Stop being so afraid of progress.

    @43:

    You’ve clearly missed the point.

    An all-in-one is a desktop PC without the case.

    I’m specifically referring to form factor, here. Why would the mass market want a huge brick to try and hide, when they can have all of their PC innards inside the screen?

    On top of that, you can play Minecraft, The Sims, WoW, etc, on just about any all-in-one, these days.

    The only people who have something to worry about are the tiny, tiny minority of hardcore graphics whores.

    #44 2 years ago
  45. Ireland Michael

    @45 So a desktop without the box, basically?

    Didn’t Apple do that with one of their Macs?

    #45 2 years ago
  46. G1GAHURTZ

    Yes.

    Yes, they did. http://www.apple.com/uk/imac/

    And?

    #46 2 years ago
  47. Ireland Michael

    @47 I’m saying, that’s still a desktop. People *want* a powerful machine in front of their desk / TV that can play the most recent games or run the most decent hardware.

    Tablets and such are undeniably great for the casual consumer, but there’s an absolutely huge market of gamers, artists, designers, programmers, etc. that will always want (and *need*) a desktop.

    #47 2 years ago
  48. BluegreenDragonfly

    @45 G1GAHURTZ,

    You sound like a person who doesn’t really like dealing with pesky things that get in the way of your arguments like facts so you start throwing out lame arguments like, “What…you don’t love Windows 8 like I do? You must be a caveman who is afraid of change.” Seriously, this is the best you can do to convince me to go out and buy Windows 8? Child psychology? LOL.

    Yes, you know me better than myself. The reason I won’t upgrade to Windows 8 over Windows 7, is that I am afraid of change. This flawed mentality is the reason so many people voted for Barrack Obama in his first run for Presidency. Spewing bullshit about racism instead of actually looking at what the man stands for. Tricked a lot of white people into voting for him. They had to prove they weren’t racist after all, right? Can’t have anyone thinking I am racist.

    Can’t have anybody telling me I am afraid of change, can I? Well dammit then, Im off to buy Windows 8. It doesn’t matter at all that Windows 8 primary user input method was focused on “touch-screen” technology over the superior keyboard and mouse. I’ll show everybody I am not afraid of change dammit. Downloading Windows 8 NOW…….uh, NOT! LOL.

    :) Lame…..

    #48 2 years ago
  49. G1GAHURTZ

    I’m a computer graphics artist by trade (but not currently by profession), and this is the PC that I use: http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/laptops/368896/dell-xps-15z

    I don’t need a big lump sitting somewhere, taking up space. Neither does any serious programmer.

    The only people who ‘do’, are hardcore gamers, and that’s exactly where my classic car enthusiast analogy fits in.

    The vast majority of PC users these days are Facebook users, and Tweeters. The hardcore are a tiny minority that wrongly consider themselves more important to PC sales than they actually are.

    #49 2 years ago
  50. G1GAHURTZ

    @49:

    I’ve never tried to “convince” you to buy anything.

    You need help.

    #50 2 years ago
  51. NocturnalB

    Who didn’t see this coming.. and they are blaming PC makers?? Granted that idiotic weird flipping tablet/laptop thing Dell came out with was… idiotic. They have no one to blame but themselves. What did they honestly expect? It’s the poorest decision they’ve ever made.

    #51 2 years ago
  52. BluegreenDragonfly

    #50 G1GAHURTZ,

    “I don’t need a big lump sitting somewhere, taking up space. Neither does any serious programmer.”

    So now you are claiming that the only message you wanted to convey to everyone reading this thread is that the PC is shrinking, yet you post this valuable insight into the future in a thread that is primarily discussing the sales of Windows 8?…like most people didn’t know that computers are shrinking constantly already? OMG. Okay, thanks for the heads up on that one. Glad I stumbled across this thread.

    I thought we were actually discussing whether Windows 8 was worth upgrading to. My mistake.

    “The only people who ‘do’, are hardcore gamers, and that’s exactly where my classic car enthusiast analogy fits in.

    The vast majority of PC users these days are Facebook users, and Tweeters. The hardcore are a tiny minority that wrongly consider themselves more important to PC sales than they actually are.”

    Do you have some kind of inside source that confirms most people are accessing Facebook via a PC? Just out of common sense my gut would have me believe otherwise. The majority of people are probably accessing Faceook and Twitter via mobile phones and tablets…Your statement is flawed unless of course you were using the word “PC” in the most liberal sense.

    #52 2 years ago
  53. G1GAHURTZ

    I think you need to brush up on your reading comprehension skills.

    Once you have, maybe you can come back to these comments, and actually have a clue as to what’s been said.

    I said that the future of the desktop is the all-in-one touchscreen. Why did I say that? Because Win8 is here for the long run. It’s built with the future in mind. A future dominated by slim form factor, touchscreen, all-in-one’s. whether desktop or tablet.

    Which is exactly the point that I made in my first comment, #7.

    The discussion was initially about why sales were slow. I gave my opinion on the matter. When touchscreens start selling more, so will Windows 8, I’m sure.

    You’re the one who didn’t get the point in the first place.

    As for Facebook/Twitter, just read that as casuals who don’t need 16GB of RAM and a $400 graphics card.

    You’re probably right about Twitter. Maybe people who store photos and send emails would have been a better description.

    #53 2 years ago
  54. BluegreenDragonfly

    @ #54 G1GAHURTZ,
    “Because Win8 is here for the long run. It’s built with the future in mind. A future dominated by slim form factor, touchscreen, all-in-one’s. whether desktop or tablet.”

    You are delusional. Windows 8 has nothing to do with form factor. You have made a prediction about the future of Windows 8 in at least 3 of your posts now. I’ll bet if you keep repeating it over and over it will eventually come true.

    Windows 8 is a failure on the desktop. And what you don’t seem to realize is that all-in-one touchscreens are ubiquitous as we speak. They are called cellphones and tablets. There’s no hardware that needs to be sold for Windows 8 to “take off”. In fact, people who wanted to upgrade to Windows 8 have done so in spite of the fact that they don’t have a touch-screen interface yet. Surface tablets are here for the “Facebook” and “Twitter” users you speak of. You first say that the majority of people who will drive Windows 8 sales into the heights of heaven are primarily Facebook users and “Tweeters”. If that’s true(and I agree that it is) why are they going to go out and just buy Windows 8 for the dinosaur desktop PC at home instead of just buying the Surface tablet? You think most people who use Facebook and Twitter are sitting at home on a desktop with a 27″ monitor and the only reason they are waiting to upgrade to Windows 8 is that they don’t have a touchscreen monitor? LOL.

    The only success Windows 8 will see from the perspective of the desktop falls under the category of “nerds who love change” and sales-by-default. In other words, licenses sold through new computers. And if your predictions about the demographic of users is correct, primarily Facebook and Twitter users(and I agree) what’s going to make people buy a Windows 8 tablet versus an Android tablet?

    Windows 8 “might” possibly succeed in the tablet consumer space. Maybe, if Microsoft can convince Facebook and Twitter users to buy it instead of an Apple iPad or an Android tablet. Not sure that’s gonna be possible considering that this demographic is probably pretty happy with what they have now.

    Windows 8 on the desktop is a FAILURE. There’s just no place for it. There’s no demand for it on the desktop. There’s no reason for me to upgrade from Windows 7. End of story.

    Oh wait, sorry. “IT BOOTS FASTER”. LOL. Forget that one. Its my favorite.

    Please, I beg you. If you don’t get help at Charter, get help some where.

    #54 2 years ago
  55. DSB

    Long run? Nah. Microsoft will have a new OS out within 3-6 years tops.

    That whole argument just reminds me of so much useless junk in the 80′s, motion sens, touchscreen etc.

    It doesn’t really matter if your technology or design is advanced or not, it matters where the customers are. At the end of the day, Microsoft should be worried about providing a service, and building that around their customers, instead of building their own ivory tower and expecting everybody else to fawn over it.

    It’s never been a clever way to run a business, and I think that’s why they’re falling behind now that others are doing it for them.

    #55 2 years ago
  56. G1GAHURTZ

    @55:

    Win8 has nothing to do with form factor?!?

    First he moans about Windows confusing tablets and desktops, then he says it has nothing to do with form factor!

    You’re clearly just wittering on now, about nothing, rather than at least trying to say anything sensible.

    Windows 8 is almost COMPLETELY about form factor. It’s about MS trying to take their PC dominance and move it into the tablet space. Windows didn’t work well on tablets. They needed to change the operating system to get it onto a new form factor of PC.

    A tablet PC, that has no mouse and no keyboard.

    Apple/Google/Amazon are selling hundreds of millions of tablets, and Microsoft are losing huge amounts of Market share. In order to get it back, they have to change their OS in order to accommodate a new form factor.

    Only an idiot would struggle to understand this with the facts in front of him.

    Also, backing up my suspicion that you simply struggle to understand basic English, you’ve confused where I said that people are waiting until they buy a touch screen device before getting Win8, with me saying that not many people have touchscreen devices.

    That’s not what I said.

    If you have a laptop with Win7, and you see the adverts, and the articles saying that Win8 is built for touchscreen, you might well wonder if you can even use it properly on your current hardware.

    So, just like I was doing, I’m sure that there are many people who are happy with Win7 until they can get a good deal on a touchscreen laptop/monitor.

    And please, don’t reply until you can quote me where I said that Facebook users have 27″ PCs.

    @56:

    When I say long run, I mean Win8, 9, 10, etc. not exclusively Win8.

    I’m sure that they are using Win8 as a bridging OS, to get people more in line with their long term goals.

    MS have never been about here and now. They build for the future. You can see that with their long term Xbox strategy, for example.

    #56 2 years ago
  57. DSB

    @57 I think the best possible way to build for the future would be to sell a lot of Windows 8 systems.

    Microsoft are in trouble right now. They’re still so huge that it will take them a while to shrink, and they pretty much still have a monopoly on operating systems, but if they don’t start delivering soon, they’re going to be eclipsed by the Googles and Apples of the world.

    I think Windows 7 won for two reasons. Mainly it gave people what they needed, and secondly people wanted it even more because Vista was so terrible.

    I think it’s near impossible to force a product on people. Either you meet them halfway, or someone else will.

    #57 2 years ago
  58. Shalindra

    @G1GAHURTZ:

    1st of all start to wipe that foam around your mouth, its gross. Now lets talk about why, you douche, cant dig why W8 is a total failboat.

    W8 its complete crap because the mass of Windows users are not retarded facebook users, but desktop ones. To force hundreds of millions of desktop souls to upgrade because you dreamed it would be nice to enter on tablet market, is not only delusional, its bad for business. And thats a fact.

    2nd, not only gamers need powerful desktops with 27″ displays, there are tons of engineers and computer artists who need things like Quadro on their daily basis. You can scream till 2013, but your crappy all in ones will NEVER even be close of a desktop from one obvious reason: Space. If you squeze 10 billion transistors into a 10cm square, imagine how much you will be able to put into a 100 cm square.

    Which sends me to the next thing, do you know who need really bad touch screens ? I’ll tell you who: the retarded fucks. And I’ll tell you why, too: The retarded fucks cant dig that thei retarded finger is NOT as precise as a 5000 dpi mouse will be. If I want I can tweak my mouse to move the cursor 2 milimeters on screen while moving the mouse 10 cm. Its called precision and you will..cough.. never be able to do that without a mouse.

    Which sends me to the next thing, why someone who is not a retarded fuck would want to have TWO ways of moving things on the screen, when he has a top one already ? I’ll tell you why again:

    Microsoft want to enter the tablet market from one simple reason, there are retarded fucks who consider hard to wield a mouse and kb. Those retarded fucks need help and also being retarded, its quite easy to get money from. Hence Windows 8. Imagine a 70 year old retarded fuck who buys a phone and he can buy a smart tv and a computer which share the same interface ! I mean, man, thas gold for retarded fucks, you dig ? They can learn only one type of interface an whoopiee doo, now they can wield all technology on earth !

    But hey, you alredy knew that, you are the computer “artist” who works in pshop, aka the guy who makes buttons, banners and shit.

    You know, a retarded fuck.

    #58 2 years ago
  59. Shalindra

    ahh and btw, I never saw a more crappy computer then Apple and I never saw a worse smartphone then Iphone.

    #59 2 years ago
  60. G1GAHURTZ

    “I think it’s near impossible to force a product on people. Either you meet them halfway, or someone else will.”

    I agree.

    I think that’s what they tried to do with Win8, by improving the whole experience in general, but replacing the Start Menu with the touch-focused interface.

    Clearly, what they didn’t realise, was just how attached people had grown to a Start Menu.

    #60 2 years ago
  61. bitsnark

    @59

    Fucking hell.

    #61 2 years ago
  62. Shalindra

    And I just reminded of something…

    VOTE OBAMA ! The perfect way to bring Islam closer to US, why in the hell would anyone want the opposite ?!

    /peace

    #62 2 years ago
  63. G1GAHURTZ

    Americans make me laugh.

    LOOOOOOL!!!

    #63 2 years ago
  64. BluegreenDragonfly

    @57 G1GAHURTZ
    “Windows 8 is almost COMPLETELY about form factor. It’s about MS trying to take their PC dominance and move it into the tablet space. Windows didn’t work well on tablets. They needed to change the operating system to get it onto a new form factor of PC.”

    Microsoft has always been about trying to make Windows run on as many different devices and form factors as possible. So, your making much ado about nothing. The difference in Windows 8 is that Microsoft radically shifted the focus of the form factor to tablets at the expense and demise of desktop functionality. This decision to focus on tablets and cellphones more than desktops is manifest in the UI more than any other part of the operating system. They haven’t changed their strategy from their previous Windows releases with regards to accomodating the maximum number of devices and their various form factors. The big difference with Windows 8, and this is key in understanding where Microsoft failed, is that, instead of using the most powerful hardware as the target of their Windows 8 operating system and scaling it down to work with less powerful hardware. They choose to design Windows 8 around the most ubiquitous hardware, which is currently tablets and cellphones which are the least powerful hardware and left out upwards scalability for those who have more powerful hardware. There was absolutely positively no reason to strip Windows 8 Aero theme from the operating system.

    “When I say long run, I mean Win8, 9, 10, etc. not exclusively Win8.”

    Oh, so when you said Windows 8 was the future what you really meant to say was Microsoft Windows is the future. *wink, wink* Hey, if it makes sense to you that’s all that matters. Am I right? :)

    #64 2 years ago
  65. Shalindra

    Nope.

    #65 2 years ago
  66. DSB

    @61 Honestly I wouldn’t know, I won’t be getting Windows 8, but a lot of the feedback I’m seeing seems to be down to problems with how (un)intuitive the design is.

    Obviously Microsoft have a problem in that they’ve used that start button for the better part of two decades now, so they’re going to have to come up with something that feels just as natural to people.

    Making a metro layout doesn’t strike me as the most obvious way to convenience people. A metro layout is pretty to look at, not functional. I’d say there’s a lot of crap in Windows that should really take up less space and fewer clicks than it does, for example.

    #66 2 years ago
  67. G1GAHURTZ

    “The difference in Windows 8 is that Microsoft radically shifted the focus of the form factor to tablets at the expense and demise of desktop functionality. This decision to focus on tablets and cellphones more than desktops is manifest in the UI more than any other part of the operating system.”

    That’s no different to what I’ve already said in these comments.

    And they have changed their strategy, they’ve had to. They never had to compete so much with Apple/Google before, so all they needed to do was put out a rebranded version of the latest OS that worked with a stylus, and leave it at that.

    Like DSB said, MS are in trouble. They’re at a point where they either change or go bust.

    For example, I personally despise Apple as a company, but I’m writing this comment on an iPad. I have one, because its an excellent product that offers me features that I can’t get on a windows device. In fact, part of the reason that I want to get a Win8 tablet, is to get rid of this thing.

    And btw, there are two versions of Win8. One for tablets, and one for high end PCs, so they haven’t scaled anything down.

    I’m not sure if I ever wrote that Win8 was “the future”, but clearly, a touch screen friendly OS is the only way that MS can go if it wants to continue to grow.

    And I’m sure that they’d much rather do that, than keep you happy.

    #67 2 years ago
  68. G1GAHURTZ

    @67:

    There is definitely a steep learning curve.

    I’ve been using it for a while now, and there are a lot of things that I hope get fixed in a service pack, someday. For a while, when I first installed it, I felt kind of cheated that I was losing functionality without a touchscreen, which my laptop doesn’t have, but after learning the shortcuts, I’ve kind of gotten around it.

    Like we’ve been discussing here, it is designed for touchscreens, so I probably wouldn’t recommend it, myself, unless you plan on getting one.

    Having said that, it works fine in general, so it shouldn’t be a problem if you did.

    #68 2 years ago
  69. BluegreenDragonfly

    @ #68 G1GAHURTZ,

    “That’s no different to what I’ve already said in these comments.”

    Well, you are very poor at communicating what you are trying to say then. Because it sounded like you said in a previous post that “Windows 8 is almost COMPLETELY about form factor.” Your quote not mine. And if you really mean what you say, that Windows 8 was developed almost completely and exclusively for tablets and cellphones to be integrated into the mix of Windows products, why would a traditional desktop user who is happy with Windows 7 have any incentive to upgrade?

    “And btw, there are two versions of Win8. One for tablets, and one for high end PCs, so they haven’t scaled anything down.”

    Good conversation but Im bored with it at this point. You love Windows 8. Im happy with Windows 7. Im gonna take a pass on Windows 8. And when Windows 9 comes out I’ll see what the buzz around it is. I just have no incentive as a desktop user to upgrade to Windows 8.

    And since, as a desktop user, I am no longer as important to Microsoft as I “thought I was” they won’t mind if I sit this one out I am sure.

    #69 2 years ago
  70. G1GAHURTZ

    You’re confusing yourself.

    You said that MS had “radically shifted” their focus to a tablet (and cellphone, which is wrong) form factor.

    I said that Win8 was almost completely about making a change to accommodate the tablet form factor.

    Where is the contradiction? Please, feel free to point it out, because unless I’m missing something, there isn’t one, and you’ve missed the point yet again.

    I have absolutely zero intention of getting into a Windows 8 selling points debate with you. You’ve clearly made up your mind on the matter, and I stopped trying to influence people’s choice of operating system a long, long time ago, when I realised that they pretty much all did the same thing in different ways.

    There are many, many Linux/Unix users who would call you a complete idiot for saying Windows 7 was anywhere near being a decent operating system, for example.

    I honestly don’t care what operating system you, or anyone else uses.

    I just think, like I said in my initial comment, that Windows 8 sales will take off when the mass market get hold of touch screen devices. My point hasn’t changed since that comment, and it still stands.

    #70 2 years ago
  71. BluegreenDragonfly

    @71 G1GAHURTZ,
    “I just think, like I said in my initial comment, that Windows 8 sales will take off when the mass market get hold of touch screen devices. My point hasn’t changed since that comment, and it still stands.”

    You keep talking as though touch-screen devices are a futuristic concept which doesn’t exist yet even though they have been ubiquitous for the past few years now. Okay, let me say this again, because it seems you have a comprehension problem. The mass market has a hold of touch screen devices. THEY ARE HERE!! You can go out and buy one NOW! They are 1)tablets, 2)cellphones, and the Windows 8 Surface tablet is on the market as we speak. So your point fails yet again. Nobody who wants to upgrade to Windows 8 is holding back because they don’t have a touch-screen device. And if there actually “are” people in that camp, they are the minority. The minority that you so loudly proclaimed doesn’t matter to Microsoft anymore. What part of my point do you not understand? If Windows 8 was going to succeed, per your comments, its going to be a success because of Facebook users and Tweeter-heads, not because of desktop users. We are an insignificant group now. We are no longer relevant. So, you keep making excuses for Windows 8 failure.

    Anyone who you “claim” is purposefully “waiting” to upgrade to Windows 8 is somebody who DOES NOT MATTER to Microsoft anymore. YOUR OWN WORDS. Enroll in a logic class in a community college. It will do wonders for you.

    Is the 16-year old teenage girl who sits at home using Facebook on the desktop saying, “You know I would just LOVE to upgrade to Windows 8 but I think I’ll wait until I get a touch-screen monitor”. Is that what you are telling everybody? LOL.

    #71 2 years ago
  72. G1GAHURTZ

    Ok, I see I’m going to have to spell this out for you in simple language.

    Maybe it’s my fault for assuming that you would be able to get your head around something very simple…

    Ok, you’re American, right?

    Go into any Best Buy or Target, and see how many $300-400 laptops that you can find with a touchscreen. See how many Windows 8 RT tablets you can find compared to iPads/Galaxy Tabs/Kindles/Nexus 7s, etc. see how many $150, Windows 8 compatible touchscreen monitors you can find.

    There aren’t many on the market right now. They are in development, and they are due to arrive, but the ones that are available now are few, and expensive.

    That’s why people are waiting.

    When someone can afford to get a fully touchscreen Windows 8 compatible device for a few hundred dollars, why would they want to stick with Windows 7?

    Right now, getting that setup comes at a premium.

    Don’t forget, that Windows is also sold around the world to poorer nations who are still running PCs that are 10 or more years old. They have 15-17″ CRT’s, but they still buy the latest versions of Windows, and provide MS with a considerable amount of their turnover.

    It’s going to take a while before people in these places can see the benefits of a touchscreen Win8 tablet over a $99 Android one. Especially at current prices.

    #72 2 years ago
  73. fearmonkey

    @60 – What? – You evidently haven’t played with many macs or Iphones then. Pretty much all the touchscreen designs currently out can be traced back to Apples Iphone release in 2007, smartphones before that were not intuitive and lame. Also, Mac’s arent the fastest machines on the block but they are the most elegant and easy to use, unless your a gamer, I would suggest a Mac for about everything else.

    @Gigahurtz – I see and understand where your coming from, but I think Windows 8 forcing the interface and not giving you a start button and choice of the Win7 interface was a bad mistake. As you said, the hardware isn’t there yet, so they are jumping the gun on forcing that win 8 interface which is lousy without a touch screen. When Items like the Kinect, leap, and even the touchpad mouse replacement controller (a touchscreen without the screen)become common place then MS can take away the start button, they just did it too early, and it sucks for mouse and keyboard.

    I work in IT and I can tell you that we dont want to roll out Windows 8, its not great for business use, and MS really screwed up. I personally hope that they learn from their mistakes and that by giving customer a choice rather than ramming their decisions down our throat, we would be far more likely to adopt their latest OS. Whoever said no we wont allow a choice, really needs to be fired…..

    #73 2 years ago
  74. ManuOtaku

    I know this is not related whatsoever, one is hardware and the other software, and for that is not an accurate analogy, and keep in mind i dont own the windowns 8 OS, but nontheless i think it has some correlation, if sony and microsoft did push technology with their consoles, which were HDTV enable since launch, but the market was not ready yet at least in the adoption rate, and i mean by this that users did not have HDTV sets on their houses to play those consoles, and they release it nontheless becuase they knew very well that was the future in the years to come, as it was, how is that so this is bad on their part to do it with this OS?, they are doing the same thing, and this is happens on a lot of industries as well, therefore i really dont understand why this is a bad call on their part, is leading the way for their own future devices, the people that do not have this devices can keep the old version, and when this devices come to the market then go for this new OS version , dont see the wrong in this IMHO, is an stablished and standard business practice.

    #74 2 years ago
  75. BluegreenDragonfly

    @ #72 G1GAHURTZ,

    “When someone can afford to get a fully touchscreen Windows 8 compatible device for a few hundred dollars, why would they want to stick with Windows 7?”

    When people can get a fully touchscreen Android or iOS device today for half the cost of a Windows 8 tablet why would they want to stick with Windows 7 OR Windows 8? Why do you keep acting like Windows 7 customers who wanted a touch-screen interface had no place to go until their savior Microsoft came along and produced Windows 8?

    You seriously need help. Translation of what you are saying now, is that people in 3rd world countries can’t afford touch-screens right now so they are waiting for the prices of those touch-screen monitors to fall. And when that happens Windows 8 will become a success. LOL.

    Why would somebody want to sit around for the next 2-3 years waiting to buy a Windows 8 compatible device when they can go out TODAY, let me say that again, they can go out TODAY and purchase a touch-screen compatible device for their Facebook and Twitter needs. And that device will be a whole lot cheaper than a Surface tablet and has been around a whole lot longer?

    Per YOUR OWN WORDS, the desktop user no longer matters to Microsoft which leaves us with, basically, “Facebook” and “Twitters”. Now explain why these people would sit around and wait on upgrading to Windows 8 when they can go out NOW and buy a touch-screen phone/tablet today?

    What you are trying to argue is that the touch-interface is a compelling reason for the masses, i.e., Facebook and Twitter users to upgrade to Windows 8, but because they can’t afford touch-screen monitors, they are waiting. And you know what I say to that theory? Total bullshit. Facebook and twitters probably couldn’t care less what OS they are using as long as it works. And if they care about using a touch-screen interface they either already purchased a touch-screen device, i.e. tablet or cellphone, or will just go out and buy a cheap tablet or cellphone. Problem solved. Why the hell would they sit around and wait for touch-screens to drop in price JUST so they can upgrade to Windows 8? You give people the impression that Windows 8 is the only operating system in existence today that uses a touch-screen interface when in fact Android and iOS have been around for the past few years.Nobody sat around and waited on Microsofts ass for the past several years to produce a touch-screen operating system or a touch-screen device before they started to purchase them. What makes you think they are sitting around on their asses waiting for Microsoft now? Give me a break. Please say something that makes logical sense for once.

    Okay. Nevermind. I give up. You win. Windows 8 is the futre!!! Because Apple and Google have no idea what they are doing. Thank God Microsoft has finally figured out what everybody wants. They will save us all. :)

    #75 2 years ago
  76. GwynbleiddiuM

    @BluegreenDragonfly I think the point of G1GA’s argument is long lost to you. Things he said are very different from the conclusions you draw.

    #76 2 years ago
  77. BluegreenDragonfly

    @ #77 GwynbleiddiuM

    “I think the point of G1GA’s argument is long lost to you. Things he said are very different from the conclusions you draw.”

    He says, in a nutshell, Windows 8 software is early(i.e. ahead of it’s time because we don’t have touch-screen monitors) but when we do people will come out of the wordwork to upgrade to Windows 8, is that right? Or to put it another way, the only thing holding back the success of Windows 8 is availability of touch-screen devices at affordable prices. If that’s the gist of his argument there’s one small problem with it. We ALREADY HAVE touch-screen devices at affordable prices. They are called tablets and cellphones.

    Gotta another question for you too. If price of new hardware is the only thing holding back the success of Windows 8 why is Apple making a killing at selling their devices at a premium? Makes ya wonder huh?

    Feel free to explain it to me in your own words. I am willing to listen to arguments if the premises logically support the conclusion but arguments like, “Windows 8 is the future, deal with it” don’t do much for me. Of course he said that in one of the very early posts in this thread.

    If Windows 8 has any chance of succeeding its “only in” the consumer tablet space. They gave the desktop users(which includes corporations) the middle finger when they designed Windows 8. As a desktop user I could care less about Windows 8 and I don’t get a tingle up my leg thinking about a new 27″ touch-screen monitor. I can afford to go out right now and buy a 27″ touch-screen monitor and Windows 8 but have no desire to. I guess maybe that’s why I can’t see what everybody else seems to be seeing.

    I think people are always trying to find a successor to retire the keyboard and mouse. I just don’t see that happening now or ever. And if you agree, that the mouse and keyboard are superior input devices over touch-input, then you have to ask yourself why Microsoft didn’t design Windows 8 UI around a keyboard and mouse. Enhancing support for touch-screen displays would have been fine with me. But designing the whole operating system UI around a persons index finger was just plain retarded.

    #77 2 years ago
  78. G1GAHURTZ

    Thank you Gwyn. Well said.

    He’s been raising arguments of his own invention for a while, now.

    The article said Win8 sales were low. I said that they will pick up when hardware prices come down.

    It’s not brain surgery. It’s simple economics.

    #78 2 years ago
  79. BluegreenDragonfly

    @ #79 G1GAHURTZ,

    “The article said Win8 sales were low. I said that they will pick up when hardware prices come down.”

    So let me get this straight. Apple is kicking ass and taking names with the sales of their tablets even though their products are being sold at premium prices but Windows 8 will take off when hardware prices come down? LOL.

    Well, I can’t argue with that. You got me my friend. Your too smart for me. When you drop the price on virtually any product in the known universe it does increase sales. Thank you for giving me a free lesson in Economics 101. :)

    Everytime G1GAHURTZ gets called on the bullshit hes spreading he changes what he said. First thing he said,
    “Windows 8 is the futre” Gets called on the bullshit. Then he changes his words to “Oh, I meant Windows in general is the future”.

    And now he’s trying to pretend like all he wanted to do was teach everybody that when prices drop on a product sales go up. Really?? Gee, thanks for sharing these golden nuggets of wisdom with us all. I feel humbled in your presence.

    Microsoft was practically GIVING their shitty operating system upgrade away for $14.99 because they know it was living on a wing and prayer and it STILL isn’t the success they thought it was going to be. Maybe if they included a coupon for a free touch-screen monitor with every Windows 8 purchase that would make it a success huh? :) You guys are killing me.

    My advice to Microsoft is to make their shitty operating system upgrade a “FREE” download for people who actually want it. And hope like hell they can remain relevant for the next 3 years until they produce a desktop operating system that people actually want. But like I already stated, $14.99 is practically free, so I am not sure there’s much hope.

    #79 2 years ago
  80. G1GAHURTZ

    Exactly what is your point?

    That Win8 is doomed?

    Is that your point??

    That sales will never pick up, and that it’s all a big mistake from MS?

    Ok. You have the last word now, since you seem to want it so much, and then come back to this forum in 3 years time, and we’ll see who was closest to the truth.

    November 2015.

    I’ll probably still be around, since I’ve been on this forum since 2008.

    Bye.

    #80 2 years ago
  81. BluegreenDragonfly

    @81 G1GAHURTZ

    From my perspective as a desktop user, “Yes”. Windows 8 is a complete failure from the perspective of most desktop users. Now I hear a lot of people saying things like, “My wife couldn’t figure out Windows 7. But I went out and bought Windows 8 and she loves it. She has an orgasm when using it just from touching the screen.” And another guy says, “My 5 year old son loves Windows 8″. Okay, I am sure they are both telling the truth. My question is why didn’t you just buy them each a tablet? Wouldn’t they have been just as happy? If Microsoft wanted to appeal to the largest audience in the universe right now, which we probably all agree is cellphone and tablet users, they didn’t NEED to release Windows 8 on the desktop. It seems to me that all they did was incite anger in their most loyal consumer base for the past 20 years which has been the desktop and business market. That’s all they accomplished by releasing this catastrophe on the desktop. They should have just released their Surface tablet and everything would have been fine. After all, that is the market they were after. Content Consumers.

    Is Windows 8 doomed? From a desktop users perspective I would say yes. If “most” people have the choice of buying Windows 8 to use on a desktop versus purchasing a Windows 8 tablet, what are most users going to purchase? “Most” people will choose either the tablet or cellphone version of Windows 8. Notice the keyword “most” people. Of course there are nerds out there drooling over having a Windows 8 desktop and then buying a Windows 8 tablet just so they can “sync” them up every once in awhile and say, “Damn, thats cool”. This group of people won’t be enough to make Windows 8 on the desktop a success. But that’s just my opinion.

    Will Windows 8 be a successful competitor to Apple and Android? Possibly. It has a much better chance of success in the mobile space over the desktop space. But even in the mobile space, they are late to the game. But anything is possible.

    P.S. The part about the “orgasm” was just me trying to be funny. I am sure most people can figure that out though.

    #81 2 years ago
  82. GwynbleiddiuM

    Well I think G1GA would be the first person to tell you we tend to disagree on a lot of arguments. So, I’m not backing him up or anything here. All I’m saying is there’s truth to what he says and I can agree with those points. Besides you take “Windows 8 is the future” literally, but is definately a HUGE stepping stone toward the future of personal computer space.

    iPad for example was the first commercially successful tablet, it was quite revolutionary in a market that didn’t exist before or rather wasn’t important to personal computer space.

    Apple was the pioneer of the market, now every OEM is trying to get a foothold. this wasn’t achieved until Android became a viable OS, for tablet/smartphone space. And where was Microsoft in all of this? Absolutely no where because their mobile version of Windows sucked balls. So they had to re-invent (invent is a strong word I guess) Windows to be able to implement it in every PC. PC nowadays isn’t just about Laptops and Desktops, Tablets and Smartphones are headed that way. And one product to cover all bases would be truly appreciated by consumers, especially Windows users who expect familiarity in their day-to-day tasks with different devices.

    We now have All-in-One PCs, which I personally don’t really like them at the moment. A huge touch-screen is not for me, but smaller ones, yeah that would work for me and many like me. Something like Asus VivoBook or TransformerBook is incredibly close to what I want for my workspace. Something I can take everywhere, when I need to do work, I attach the keyboard and mouse, take to meetings, seminars, everywhere. The docking part that G1GA mentioned in one of his posts, a device that I can take everywhere, connect it through a small docking station to my monitor at work, attach my M&B, then go home and synch my tasks and work files on my desktop, continue where I left off with all my applications, then re-synch, without the unnecessary headaches and conversions between different devices with different operating systems and file extensions and all the whatnot.

    But the price point and technological advantages of these devices are not intuitive enough for me to go there yet. Once the competition is heated and new devices with newer and affordable tech comes out, I’d be jumping in. At the moment, I’m happy with having my Desktop, and taking my heavy laptop to everywhere for work (and of course play games).

    Windows 8 has a lot of advantages, but the disadvantages are currently holding it back. Like the lack of competitive market, devices with affordable price range, stupid copy paste of Apple’s appstore with limitations on both consumer side and developer side, and of course my favorite; regional restrictions. I’m sure there are more facts to consider, but at the very core, Windows 8 can provide Desktops, Laptops, Tablets and Smartphones users with similar experiences, and it can get better. I just hope Microsoft be a little more flexible and less greedy. At their core they’re monopolists, that mentality is not gonna work for them, especially with the threat of open-source platforms on the rise.

    I hope I explained it well enough without making it more confusing. :P

    #82 2 years ago

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    We have 10,000 codes to give away for MMOFPS Survarium, granting the player a Premium account for 24 hours along with 5,000 Silver coins. Each key gives the player a Premium account for 24 hours along with 5,000 Silver in-game currency. A Premium account gives you 50 percent more experience, income and reputation for 24 […]

  • “I don’t like people thinking we’re doing underhanded, dirty shit,” says Evolve dev

    Despite what it looks like, Evolve developers did not intend to give out the wrong signals when it comes to the game’s DLC plan. Evolve creative director Phil Robb spoke to Destructoid in an interview that was conducted late last year about the studio’s approach to DLC, map packs and more. Robb’s idea is that […]

  • Clock Tower spiritual successor Night Cry gets first screens

    Night Cry is coming along nicely and today we get our first look at it. Ever since the announcement of Project Scissors (at the time) last September, and then the name change to Night Cry, we’ve been waiting to see what the game looks like, especially since it’s developed with mobile platforms in mind. Today, […]

  • Tekken X Street Fighter is still happening, 40 people working on it

    Tekken X Street Fighter is definitely not vaporware. A team of 40 developers is currently working on it, according to director Katushiro Harada. Harada was interviewed by Polygon. In the interview, he touched on many topics, one of which is the status of the seemingly-never-coming-out Tekken X Street Fighter. “It’s very difficult to talk about,” […]

  • From Game of Thrones to Borderlands: all of Telltale’s adventure games rated

    Telltale Games has an impressive back catalogue of licensed adventure games to its name, and we have opinions about all of them. Note that this rundown doesn’t include bundles, the non-adventure games or games published by Telltale but created by other developers. It’s also got a fair bit of speculation in it, since at least […]

  • There is probably a new Battletoads game coming

    If you’ve watched last night’s Windows presentation you knew you recognised that logo on Phil Spencer’s t-shirt. Wearing a t-shirt with a logo of an upcoming game is an antic we’ve come to expect from Xbox boss Phil Spencer now. Based on that, we wouldn’t be alone in predicting that a new Battletoads game is […]

  • Here’s a short, 60fps trailer for DmC: Definitive Edition

    DmC: Definitive Edition has a new video available that shows the game running at 60 frames-per-second. Capcom has put out a short new trailer for the Definitive Edition of DmC: Devil May Cry that takes a look at different stages and boss fights. The video begs to watched in 1080p60 quality, if your connection can […]

  • Xbox One to PC streaming targeting 1080p, 60fps

    Microsoft has revealed that it’s looking to achieve 1080p resolution at 60 frames-per-second when the Xbox One game streaming launches later this year. The question of what final resolution and framerate Xbox One game streaming will operate at was on a lot of people’s minds when the demo was shown. Thankfully, Microsoft’s Mike Ybarra has […]

  • Microsoft is looking at offering PC to Xbox streaming

    Having announced Xbox One to PC streaming as part of its Windows event last night, Microsoft said that making the process a two-way street is on the cards. Microsoft’s Phil Spencer sat down to do a group interview following the Windows event and talked a little bit about the firm’s plans for streaming, including a […]

  • Watch John Romero play Doom

    John Romero made DOOM, and now you can watch him play it, dropping many a delightful gem of insight regarding one of the most important shooters of all time. This video was organised by Double Fine as part of its Devs Play series, a thing I only just discovered and now want to marathon all […]

  • World of Speed has gotten fairly pretty over the past year

    World of Speed has produced a new trailer, showing off the racing MMO’s progress over the past year. Announced one year ago, World of Speed is looking pretty damn shiny now. Check it out in this trailer, which introduces the Mountain Spiral Road location and teases several yet to be revealed. World of Speed comes […]

  • Minecraft user data leaked in plain text – change your passwords

    Minecraft users should change their passwords and those of any accounts using the same log-in details. Minecraft’s user data servers have apparently been compromised, with user names and passwords leaked online in plain text. 1,800 Mojang accounts were affected. The news comes via German source Heise and The Guardian and has been treated quite seriously […]

  • Resident Evil: The Final Chapter will commence filming in August

    The sixth Resident Evil movie is back on track. Resident Evil: The Final Chapter will begin filming in August, having been delayed to accomodate star Milla Jovovich’s pregnancy. In a Facebook post, Jovovich said she’s currently being very mindful of gaining enough weight to ensure a healthy birth for her second child, without the risk […]

  • Nintendo bosses “do not really understand modern gaming”, says former executive

    Former Nintendo executive Dan Adelman has provided frank insight into the Japanese platform holder’s inner workings. Adelman, who was one of Nintendo’s most important developer liaisons, left in August 2014. One of the first things he did was say that Nintendo had issued a gag order on his social media use, and shortly thereafter called […]

  • Sony’s 10% apology discount doesn’t apply to pre-orders

    Sony has updated the terms and conditions of its apology discount to exclude pre-orders. PSN members have been offered a 10% discount voucher as an apology for downtime over the holidays due to DDoS attacks. In an update to the PlayStation Blog announcement post, Sony clarified that you can’t use this for pre-orders. So. That […]

  • 343 to beta test Halo: The Master Chief Collection matchmaking fix

    Halo: The Master Chief Collection is still broken, believe it or not. The next Halo: The Master Chief Collection update is, like most of the others so far, designed to resolve the shooter collection’s ongoing matchmaking woes. 343 Industries is determined to get it right, apparently, as it’s gone so far as to elect to […]

  • Here’s the release schedule for Star Citizen’s story and first-person modules

    Star Citizen lead Chris Roberts has shared release windows for several modules of the space simulation sandbox. Star Citizen was the focus of a BAFTA Masterclass presentation yesterday, during which Roberts outlined the game’s current development milestone goals. Polygon captured the details. The first person shooter, planetside and social elements on the game are expected […]

  • Destiny: Crota’s End Hard Mode has already been beaten

    Destiny’s toughest challenge got extra tough today, but a troop of willing Guardians stepped up to the line of duty. Destiny developer Bungie has verified the identities of the first Guardians to beat hard mode for the Crota’s End raid, which launched earlier today. Bungie User Research has confirmed the World First finishers for the […]

  • All maps and modes for Battlefield Hardline detailed

    A third map and mode has been announced for Battlefield Hardline which means all modes and maps have been revealed. The new mode is Crosshair, a second competitive mode in which a former criminal “turned state’s witness” is on the run. His former buddies, who are criminals, are trying to kill him and the cops […]

  • Alien: Isolation has sold over 1 million copies

    Alien: Isolation has sold over 1 million copies, Creative Assembly and SEGA announced today, and probably in joyous fashion, although PR mails never denote the writer’s mood. The quote included from creative lead, Alistair Hope does sound as though he is super pleased with the milestone. “It has been fantastic to watch the reviews come […]

  • Fable Legends launching on PC alongside Xbox One with cross-platform play

    Fable Legends was announced for PC today during Microsoft’s Windows 10 event, along with the news it would contain cross-platform play with Xbox One. The game will allow you to play with up to four of your friends online across both platforms. A video from the team at Lionhead, which goes into more detail, was […]

  • Parkour pioneer David Belle acted as a consultant on Dying Light

    It has been announced that actor, stunt coordinator and leading pioneer of Parkour, David Belle, consulted on Dying Light in order to bring authentic parkour to the game. According to a press release sent over by Techland, the development team worked with Belle to “verify the depiction of parkour” in the game as well as […]