Geohot being sued over PS3 jailbreak for “making Sony mad”

Friday, 14th January 2011 09:59 GMT By Johnny Cullen


George “Geohot” Hotz has overnight defended his jailbreaking of PS3, saying he’s being sued by Sony for “making” the company “mad”.

Speaking on G4′s Attack of the Show last night, Geohot said that his jailbreak has set “precedent” after his previous victory in jailbreaking the iPhone for the first time.

The iPhone hack challenged the law related to such hacking in the US and found it legal, according to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA).

“Currently the difference is the DMCA says specifically mobile phones, but the same precedent should apply. If they decide a phone is a closed system, where the manufacturer controls all the software that runs on it, if you can Jailbreak one closed system, why can’t you Jailbreak another,” he said.

“Right now, still legally, you can go to my website and download my Jailbreak for your PS3.

“It lets you install homebrew applications, which have been developed by anyone. You can develop your own application or go download some and put them on your Jailbroken PS3.”

Hotz insisted that his jailbreak was not to be used for piracy and said he made a “specific effort” to make sure it was considered not to have done so.

“The way piracy was previously done doesn’t work in my Jailbreak. I made a specific effort while I was working on this to try to enable homebrew without enabling things I do not support, like piracy.”

Asked why he was being sued by Sony, Hotz said it was for “making Sony mad”.

And when asked at the end what was coming next, Hotz joked that PSP2 was on the list.

“When does the PSP2 come out? No, I’m kidding,” he said.

Sony issued a restraining order against GeoHot and hacker group fail0verflow this week for publishing the console’s root key, which has apparently exposed the hardware once and for all.

Yesterday, it was reported that jailbroken PS3 systems could be banned even without PSN access.

We published a broad piece of the recent spate of PS3 hacking yesterday morning, featuring insight from analyst Michael Pachter and Braid developer Jonathan Blow: read it here.

Watch the full Attack of the Show interview below.



  1. anuekr

    He broke the law, never mind how much u spray perfume on a piece of shit it’s still a piece of shit, he can say whatever he wants, bottom line, he broke the law, Sony sews him, he should admit he broke the law, go to jail or pay the fine or whatever.

    #1 4 years ago
  2. Joe Anderson

    Your a no good pirate Mr Hotz.

    #2 4 years ago
  3. Aimless

    @2 I really don’t think he is. Hacking and piracy aren’t the same thing.

    I completely disagree with what he did as I view it as irresponsible and selfish, but demonising people doesn’t do anyone any favours.

    #3 4 years ago
  4. Rhythm

    @1 – what law has he broken? He’s violated the terms of the EULA at the very most. Nothing he’s done has been illegal. Immoral, maybe, illegal, no

    #4 4 years ago
  5. Blerk

    Quite. I guess that’s what Sony will be trying to prove, but given that Apple didn’t manage it…

    #5 4 years ago
  6. Psychotext

    “He’s violated the terms of the EULA at the very most.”

    …and possibly not event that. The PS3 he used for hacking was given to him used which means he wouldn’t have had to agree to a EULA. If he signed up a PSN account he’d have had to have agreed to the ToS, but I don’t believe he did that either.

    It’s not his first rodeo.

    #6 4 years ago
  7. Lloytron

    @1 Which law specifically did he break?

    Something interesting may happen here. If the judge finds in favour of Mr Hotz (and having read the case and evidence that Sony are submitting, this is quite likely) then there will possibly be a legal precedent set about Jailbreaking consoles being legal.

    Could there then be countersuits against console manufacturers that would force them to allow their consoles to be jailbroken or run unsigned code?

    #7 4 years ago
  8. Blerk

    Well, we haven’t seen that happen on the iPhone yet so I’m guessing “no”.

    #8 4 years ago
  9. jnms

    @7, Exactly, no one has yet said exactly which law GeoHot has broken. Everyone is acting like he has come to their house and left a turd in their coffee – yet he hasn’t even commited a crime.

    Sure he may be irresponsible, egotistical and even a complete dick; but last I checked those weren’t reasons enough to be fined or imprisoned.

    It seems to me that people are too willing to open a very slippery slope to corporate run ideology and morality.

    #9 4 years ago
  10. Aimless

    Something else to consider is that I highly doubt Sony are hoping to be ‘winners’ in this case. I’m sure they don’t want to lose, but ultimately the damage has been done: this is a delaying tactic to try and give their engineers breathing room, plus a demonstration of pro-activity for their various business partners.

    They couldn’t not sue him.

    #10 4 years ago
  11. Robo_1

    I would like to see the smug cocksure look slapped off his face though.

    There are very real repercussions to what he (and the fail guys) did, and I do think there should be laws in place which protect businesses from having irreparable harm done to them by hackers, just as there should be laws to protect the rights of individuals to use their private property in any way they see fit.

    It’s still very early days with all this, and I imagine it will take cases like this – and likely many more – to find a suitable middle ground. My own view is that the rights of the individual should be – at the very least – challenged, when their actions can cause harm to others, and clearly in this case, Sony’s business model and that of their development partners has been badly damaged, and it seems unjust to me that those most responsible for that, have no case to answer for their actions.

    #11 4 years ago

    Oooooooh, the drama.

    #12 4 years ago
  13. Blerk

    I have to admit, the backlash from the users against this guy has surprised me somewhat. I don’t recall there ever being such outrage in the past when other systems have been hacked. Is there something particularly bad about this hack compared to the others?

    #13 4 years ago
  14. Lloytron

    @11 Even though everyone involved says this isn’t about piracy, there can be no doubt that this can and will help those intent on pirating games to do so. As you say this will potentially impact Sony and their partners business model. But being irresponsible isn’t against the law.

    Also lets not forget the real reason that they could work these keys out. Sony didn’t manage their security policies correctly. They setup a sophisticated security system, but were negligent in their management of it. Sony are partially if not fully responsible for any impact this has on their business.

    #14 4 years ago

    @ 13:

    No, the people who support him are probably just too busy downloading loads of free games to worry about commenting on the internet…

    #15 4 years ago
  16. Aimless

    “Also lets not forget the real reason that they could work these keys out. Sony didn’t manage their security policies correctly. They setup a sophisticated security system, but were negligent in their management of it. Sony are partially if not fully responsible for any impact this has on their business.”

    I’m really not comfortable with that. Yes part of Sony’s security team made a massive gaff, but the PS3 has proven to be the most resilient console ever up to that point.

    Laying the blame at Sony’s feet is like pointing the finger at me for only having one lock on my door when burglars broke in; there’s more I could have done and I’ll be more careful in the future, but I’m not responsible for someone choosing to raid my home.

    As for the backlash against geohot, I think a large part of it is that he isn’t some faceless entity. He also comes across as a bit of a nob and everyone likes seeing the smug fall in the mud.

    #16 4 years ago
  17. KL

    let’s see a spoiled brat vs hundrends of people doing their job to feed their families.
    Sony isn’t an individual person now is it?

    #17 4 years ago
  18. Lloytron

    @16 That’s not strictly true. PS3 security was ‘jailbroken’ before these keys got released. These keys just make it easier now.

    The burglary analogy doesn’t really stand up – A better analogy would be that you have a secure electronic lock on your door and someone has found a secret pin number that opens any of them, and told people what it is.

    #18 4 years ago
  19. Aimless

    @19 But it was jailbroken by virtue of a stolen piece of Sony maintenance hardware and that wasn’t until August 2010, almost 4 years into the console’s life.

    My analogy wasn’t used to draw a full parallel to the current situation, it was to address the claim that Sony are responsible for people choosing to attack their security. It’s like when people say rape victims were “asking for it” by wearing short skirts; pure buck passing.

    #19 4 years ago
  20. RandomTiger

    @ 16 The locked door is one of the better analogies I’ve seen but its still flawed since the physical device unquestionably belongs to who ever paid for it, the software is another matter of course.

    Hotz says he is unlocking the system but trying not let pirates in as he does it. Correct me if I’m wrong but no-one can actually run a pirated game on the PS3 currently. However of course what he has done will make it easier for people who do want to hack it for piracy.

    Do I wonder how many of the people who condemn him have never pirated a game, or a film, or music, or a TV show, or swapped a mixed tape/CD with a friend or played an emulator with downloaded roms.

    #20 4 years ago
  21. Aimless

    “Do I wonder how many of the people who condemn him have never pirated a game, or a film, or music, or a TV show, or swapped a mixed tape/CD with a friend or played an emulator with downloaded roms.”

    This is a fallacious argument. It’s akin to me saying you can never take a moral stance on violence if you’ve ever hit someone or be a vegetarian if you’ve ever eaten meat.

    In my young teens I pirated PC games; friends gave me copied CDs, I installed them and didn’t really think about it. Now I know better, I acknowledge the ramifications of such things and realise the value of fair economy.

    Even if I was a complete hypocrite and pirated games to this day, that still wouldn’t affect the validity of points I made against it. It would leave me open to ad hominem attacks, accusations levelled against the person in lieu of having a valid counterpoint, but valid reasoning stands tall on its own merits.

    #21 4 years ago
  22. Lloytron

    @19 So do we know that the jailbreak devices actually were based on stolen Sony tech? I read somewhere that this wasn’t true.

    Again that analogy isn’t really true either because Hotz and co haven’t directly enabled piracy, but they have shown others that might want to a possible way of getting there.

    Again that analogy doesn’t really hold. The analogies are implying crimes – calculating a number and distributing it isn’t necessarily a crime.

    A better analogy would be suing Stanley if you were a victim of knife crime.

    #22 4 years ago
  23. NinjaMidget

    @13 I’ll hold my hand up and admit I haven’t taken major issue with piracy until recently. The full weight of piracy hasn’t exactly been pointed out to me in the gaming world until now.

    I think part of the reason for the huge backlash is that now the supposedly the most ‘security conscious’ console has been broken there is no hope for any other console coming out.

    Now that this has become aware to me (and the fact that I want to be a game designer, and this sort of thing screws the industry up) I’m getting pretty angry about it.

    #23 4 years ago
  24. Mike

    Sony doesn’t have a leg to stand on. End of.

    And I don’t think GeoHot has pirated anything. So “Your a no good pirate” (should be you’re – but anyway), really doesn’t hold any water at all.

    #24 4 years ago
  25. RandomTiger

    @23 What *is* the full weight of piracy? Its really important to remember a pirated game doesn’t always equate to a lost sale. If it can be kept to low levels its not important.

    The DS was pirated massively and Nintendo are not going out of business any time soon. The PS3 did well to last so long (even if you do believe that was down to Linux functionality) and it only failed so quickly because Sony made a massive error in their security. Clearly there’s a risk the PS3 is going to become the easiest console to use pirated games on but I think most Sony customers are quite happy to pay for their games, certainly enough to keep their business going.

    The games industry will be fine, the console side of things may change but I work in the industry and I believe we piracy is not the biggest issue we face.

    #25 4 years ago
  26. NightCrawler1970

    Basically what GeoHotz do, is ruined PS3 by hacking and cracking the system, because Sony said, that PS3 is uncrackable.

    It’s a challenge for any hacker/cracker to crack the system and as proof, they come with a stick, even for now on, i can’t use any USB stick(just to copy my movies from stick to HDD), now that Sony have disabled, only my Ext HDD will work on my PS3…

    I also understand for the most student that bought the PS3 at the first place, NOT AS A GAME-CONSOLE, but also for running “otherOS” for the most student is “LINUX”..

    A normal PC cost at least $1200,- or more to run smooth and fast…
    Sony comes up with a console in the beginning for $599,- in that time “otherOS” was included, so that most people can install “linux or Windows”, but windows doesn’t runs great on PS3..
    Linux you can download FREE, and if you make partition on internal HDD, you can install “OtherOS” on PS3..
    included Firefox browser to browse on youtube and other pages…

    Now Sony Delete that “OtherOS” for security reason..
    and most people that already have linux with there private stuff on it, they lose access on PSN(specially) when YOU MUST UPDATE this system, but you lose “OtherOS”, included your personal files on it…
    It’s a choice for those people..

    Other people complaining about when comes a better browser for PS3 and PSP, because my blackberry can handle more than that lousy PSP…
    A smart remark, “Well if you wanna browse online” DO IT WITH A PC, not with a PS3 or PSP….

    I realy like my old fatty that still alive and kicking, but if that “GEOHOTZ” gonna fuck with Sony, just to ruin them, and if Sony gonna sue them, and Sony lose the case, i bet GEOHOTZ, gonna claim them big time..

    I cross my fingers that Sony will win, so we as PS3-gamers will have lot’s of fun on the PS3-console…

    #26 4 years ago
  27. Aimless

    @22 Certainly as far as I know. I don’t claim to be omniscient, though, so if you can find something to the contrary I’d be interested to read it.

    I feel you’re missing the underlying point. I’m not trying to draw a parallel between the situations, merely illustrate the tendency towards moral buck passing.

    I’ve zero problem with people cracking devices for homebrew — it doesn’t effect me, they can do as they want — but the key difference in this case is that releasing the hack they did was inevitably going to lead to piracy; this isn’t an unforeseen outcome, anyone could see it coming.

    For arguments sake let’s assume every single person involved in the hack abhors piracy in all its forms. If that is the case how can they, in good conscious, enable a practise they revile? Not directly, no, but knowingly and for somewhat questionable benefits.

    I fully admit it’s a grey area, but to go with your knife analogy think of it as the reseller of said blade selling it to someone who they know, for whatever reason, will misuse it. Legally they’ve done nothing wrong, but the moment you’re a gatekeeper — the second you have power — you also inherit some responsibility.

    @25 I don’t see piracy as the world ending threat some people like to paint it as — there will always be more honest consumers than not — but there’s no question that it negatively impacts an already ailing industry.

    Enough people are losing their jobs, and publishers becoming risk averse, without pirates sticking the boot in.

    #27 4 years ago
  28. Robo_1

    I agree with all of that Aimless, well put.

    #28 4 years ago
  29. back_up

    now PC and 360 gamers would buy PS3 for playing Pirating games

    #29 4 years ago
  30. Lloytron

    @27 I understand what you are getting at and yes, it’s arguably morally dubious, and potentially irresponsible – but thats about it as far as I can see. From what I can tell (I’m no lawyer) none of this is illegal. You can’t sue someone just for being a massive arsehole (I’d probably be in prison if you could!)

    I’ve read through the papers Sony have submitted as evidence and a lot of it is laughable. Pheonix Wright has more solid evidence than this!

    Sony don’t seem to be able to point out any specific article of law that has been broken, and the evidence is a collection of articles grabbed from the web. It’s quite funny reading actually in places.

    The fact that they are demanding this guy’s computers to be locked down to prevent the already published keys and tools from being made available on the internet just shows how naive the prosecution are being.

    #30 4 years ago
  31. Lloytron

    BTW if you want to talk about being morally dubious, one of the items Sony are suing for are for profiteering through the JB.

    Their evidence? They sent him some money via paypal.

    #31 4 years ago
  32. Hybridpsycho

    He screwed a bunch of developers over, that’s what he did.

    Fucking douche should be shot.

    #32 4 years ago
  33. Aimless

    @30 Sure, I don’t think they’ve done anything illegal.

    As I mentioned back in comment 10, Sony had to sue them. It’s not going to fix anything but they can’t be seen by shareholders and their partners to be doing nothing. Politics!

    #33 4 years ago
  34. Psychotext

    “He screwed a bunch of developers over, that’s what he did.”

    How? He specifically coded his hack to make piracy more difficult, doing it in such a way that the already released backup rippers / loaders wouldn’t work.

    Scream and shout at the people writing the piracy related tools, absolutely, but Geohot isn’t one of them. He’s an egotistical prick, certainly… but sadly that’s not against the law.

    #34 4 years ago
  35. Lloytron

    @33 sorry I missed that bit. yes, totally agree, this is Sony grandstanding, they don’t have any choice.

    However what happens if they lose? If jailbreaking your console to run homebrew code is judged as being legal, does it then follow that preventing this is illegal? Could it be argued that future consoles have to be open to some degree?

    @32 What, did he become a publisher? :P

    #35 4 years ago
  36. Gheritt White

    You know, the X360 has been cracked for ages and I don’t recall EVER seeing this amount of whining/hand-wringing. What precisely has been ruined? It all just smacks of SDF PMS if you ask me.

    #36 4 years ago
  37. Blerk

    It’s a double-bluff – everyone’s high-horsing to kill time while they’re downloading torrents. :-D

    #37 4 years ago
  38. NinjaMidget

    @25 Good point, didn’t look at it that way.

    I suppose our opinions might be influenced by how evil we think people are!

    #38 4 years ago
  39. OlderGamer


    I agree with you that this hacking of the PS3 is not going to spell the end of the world for Sony or the PS3. I think that a lot of folks are for whatever reason taking this personialy.

    But I was wondering what do you feel is the biggest threat to the industry as a whole?

    I have a few theories from Over budgeted games/game prices, stagnet console tech, (not so)microtransactions/dlc, to second hand game sales.

    But if ya don’t mind whats your pov?

    #39 4 years ago
  40. Blerk

    Actually this could be pretty bad:
    PS3 hack unlocks trophies.

    #40 4 years ago
  41. theevilaires


    people will fucking cheat man destroying the trophy system!

    #41 4 years ago
  42. Gekidami

    ^ Thats been doable on 360 since forever. I wouldnt say its destroyed anything there.

    #42 4 years ago
  43. xino

    what is wrong with these people!?

    do people have their head under their ass???

    Hacking an hardware is not breaking the fuking law, you bought it you own the shit!
    It’s like building a fucking house, I can do whatever the fuck I want with it! If I’m renting it, then I will have to follow the rules!

    I am not renting a ps3, I bought it! I am renting PSN instead!

    Hotz did make sure the hack did not support piracy, but someone boasted and made configured the hack and made it possible!

    #43 4 years ago
  44. theevilaires

    He shouldn’t have made it public if all he wanted to do is score a job at SONY and use Linux on a damn PC rather than a PS3.

    Come on do you really think a judge will believe that the same guy who hacked the iphone doesn’t have PC to run linux on. SONY can add and take away features as they please anytime. Its part of the user agreement which 99.9% of people don’t read and the reason all those ass hole who bought Natal are getting spied on by M$ in your very home without you even having the slightest clue.


    You may own the machine but you don’t own the OS and its not his job to post info world wide on how to use such code to cause mass uncomfort and displeasure to legit users of the system which is PSN. Let me in that court room and I guarantee I’d get this mother fucker the max time allowed by law.

    #44 4 years ago
  45. Gheritt White

    So… where was your ire when this happened to the X360, then? All this FANBOY RAAAAAAGE stinks of hypocrisy to me.

    #45 4 years ago
  46. Gekidami

    ^ Where are the news posts about that?

    #46 4 years ago
  47. Gheritt White

    All the ones from last year about MS banning people from XBL spring to mind. I’m not PT, so I can’t be arsed to search for them.

    #47 4 years ago
  48. theevilaires

    Wait what did I do now, I’m confused :D

    #48 4 years ago
  49. Holesome

    @18, “A better analogy would be that you have a secure electronic lock on your door and someone has found a secret pin number that opens any of them, and told people what it is.

    This is more like…….buying a room for your house where Sony is controlling the lock and trying to dictate to you what things you are allowed to put inside it and what you are allowed to do in your own house. The what-seems-so-amazing lock that came with the room is the only thing stopping you from doing what you want with your room. “Today I’d like to dance in my new room that I own.” you say to yourself. Believing you, and anyone else, have the right to use the room in your house as you see fit you try to pick the lock only to find out that the security was flawed from the start due to glaring design flaws. Being a good citizen and believing everyone else should know about the flaws and that others may also like to use their rooms for whatever they choose you let the world know how flawed the lock is and exactly how to open it.

    The unfortunate side effect is that while you and many others may only want to move your own contents into wonderful new and exciting room, including your couch, tv, br player, and movies and games you have bought, there are others who choose to store other people things, without their permission, inside their rooms in their own houses.

    Don’t worry about the security of your newly jailbroken room as it’s inside your house which has it’s own lock and key.

    #49 4 years ago
  50. Gekidami

    But you asked where all the “rage” was when this happened to 360. Not what peoples reactions were to it a few years later in regards to what MS was doing about it.

    #50 4 years ago
  51. OlderGamer


    About spot on perfect.

    #51 4 years ago
  52. Gheritt White

    @ 56: The point about complete absence of RAAAAAAGE remains, though.

    #52 4 years ago
  53. Gekidami

    ^Seems like you’re mad the 360 didnt get as much attention when it got hacked.

    And anyway, “rage” about what? That MS was banning pirates? Not much to rage about really.

    #53 4 years ago
  54. RandomTiger

    (off topic)

    @39 Lots of things adding up to big problems, it seems to me the publisher / developer model is broken, I think games could be made better and cheaper if developers weren’t constantly subject to day to day mechanics that have come from short term thinking and/or technical decisions that are made on the basis of marketing or the risk avoidance strategies of publishers. In turn developers need to become more reliable and disciplined with the way they deal with publishers. I could go on and on but I believe most of our real problems are internal issues with the way the industry works and what it expects of people and companies. There’s a lot of necessary short term thinking with developers due to the way we, or most of us are funded.

    At the moment everything is changing, platforms, business models, peripherals, distributions models, too much is changing really to make sense of it but at the end of the day there more than enough customers and money to keep a very healthy industry going and its quite sad that publishers and developers struggle to break even at the best of times.

    #54 4 years ago
  55. Gheritt White

    @ 53: Not really, frankly I don’t really care as it doesn’t directly affect me anymore. I just don’t like all this SDF angst masquerading as genuine concern for “the industry”.

    Why? Boredom, mostly. It’s been a slow couple of days.

    #55 4 years ago
  56. TheWulf

    Sigh. Analogies. They’re just not necessary. It all boils down to this:

    - Sony doesn’t add Other OS to the PS3 Slim. No one has any issues with this since it’s not an advertised feature.
    - Sony removes Other OS from the older PS3 models, because apparently it’s too expensive to maintain. However, this wasn’t their call to make considering that it was an advertised feature that the consumer owning the hardware had every right to use.
    - A hacker group hosted a security seminar in which they detailed a security exploit, and unveiled a practical proof of concept wherein the system could be hacked to restore the Other OS functionality and allow for homebrew.
    - It’s pretty clear at this point that the patch doesn’t invite piracy and doesn’t make the process easy for pirates to enjoy free games on the PS3. It’s about the security flaw, homebrew, and regaining Other OS.
    - People on Internet forums go into Bilious Dialectic Mode, and start spewing nonsense and FUD about how pirates were handed the magical key to the city, and how no one has to pay for their games any more, because the pirates have already won.
    - Some people — more informed people — sigh and shake their heads.

    /sighs and shakes his head.

    #56 4 years ago
  57. Benjo1981

    @The Wulf

    “It’s pretty clear at this point that the patch doesn’t invite piracy and doesn’t make the process easy for pirates to enjoy free games on the PS3. It’s about the security flaw, homebrew, and regaining Other OS.”

    Firstly, we only have their testimony to go on. For all we know, piracy and malicious use of the PS3, could have been their intention. They’re not totally stupid, they wouldn’t come out and openly admit to promoting piracy in such a public fashion.

    However, what I just suggested could be said to be drenched in paranoia. After all, we can claim almost anything with that reasoning.

    It’s not simply about the security flaw becauase they could have dealt with that by going to Sony. Why publish it online for others to use?

    It might very well have been for homebrew apps and the retrieval of the OtherOS feature. But, again, why release it to the public?

    I’m no expert, but it’s my understanding that this hack does indeed give pirates the keys to, well, pirating games more easily. No?

    #57 4 years ago
  58. osric90

    Geohot, you’re days of youth will be over in jail…unless you break! Got it? JailBreak? Meh, never mind.

    #58 4 years ago
  59. MushroomStamp

    Some of you don’t understand that he did not break any laws here in the US. In the US, Jailbreaking is legal.

    Also, MS does NOT brick consoles. It prevents them from gaining access to Live. Sony doesn’t own a network, so I don’t see much that they can do. Well they can probably stop you from the Paid version of PSN+, but that’s it. At least here in the US.

    #59 4 years ago
  60. Lloytron

    Looks like Sony isn’t winning the fight. The restraining order apparently was not granted.

    “As of 2:00 PM EST, 1/14/2011, I am not subject to any TROs”

    Source, the man himself on

    #60 4 years ago
  61. Psychotext

    Aye, first round to Geohot:

    #61 4 years ago
  62. MushroomStamp

    Because he didn’t break any laws :) This is how innovation happens. Someone wants to do something that isn’t being done.. and finds a way to do it. It’s a cat and mouse game… Geo is playing by the rules, and Sony doesn’t like the loophole… but that’s business.

    #62 4 years ago
  63. Psychotext

    That’s only one small stage of the process Mushroom. Long way to go yet.

    #63 4 years ago
  64. MushroomStamp

    *Previous post removed, was placed in wrong forum*

    P.S. Tea, i mentioned nothing about morals and conduct, merely stated the guy didn’t violate any laws, Stop trying to troll and stir the pot.

    #64 4 years ago
  65. theevilaires

    A pirate giving lessons on conduct and morals….WOW I’ve seen it all now

    #65 4 years ago

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