Pachter: Modern Warfare 2 could sell 14 million

I hope the game bombs after the backstabbing of PC gamers.

It wont, mainly due to most of the sales coming from the console versions. And even then i bet the PC version still sells well.

There was no backstabbing. I mean seriously if you wish ill will on a game JUST because it doesn’t support dedicated servers. Then you aren’t really a gamer that the gaming community needs. This game will kick ass on all platforms… and NONE will use dedicated servers. So feel free to miss out on the biggest videogame in history because your to stubborn/silly to get over something that doesn’t really matter.

“biggest videogame in history”

Mmm… hyperbole.

@MushroomStamp

Biggest game of all time? No.

They back stabbed the PC community, period. Even worse they tried to fly this announcement under the radar and 3 weeks from the launch of the game.

Have fun playing with obnoxious 12 year olds, racists, and other total idiots..and you can’t do anything about it but leave the game and hope you get lucky next match..

Have fun hoping you get a good connection while the host has the clear advantage, lol.

Have fun playing the same rehashed gameplay as CoD4. Adding a dozen new perks and maps doesnt make it the biggest game of all time. Rofl.

MushroomStamp, dedicated servers might mean nothing to you, but to many PC gamers it’s why they’re still PC gamers.

You get better multiplayer performance and it’s fairer, no host advantage.

And actually, yes I think he is the type of gamer the community needs, because it’s not fair for a company to institute features, or in this case remove them that affect paying customers in a misguided effort to tackle piracy, and it needs gamers to let them know how bullshit this is.

I’d laugh if this game was pirated 10x more than the last one, and I wouldn’t feel sorry for Acti one bit, because they will have shat those profits away by themselves.

Even without dedicated servers you can still have a private match can’t you? You can on consoles. So the issue is just the host thing or is it about mods?

Communities are built around dedicated servers, You cant just hope your specific list of friends are online for a private match.

It’s not about private matches.

Yeah, there is the mod issue, they still haven’t shown how or even if they’re going to work in custom maps.

Host advantage is where the game host experiences zero lag and thus has an advantage. Dedicated servers mean everyone is equal as long as they have similar pings.

I play on PC also… I know that a dedicated server is NICE…but in NO WAY is a company obligated to provide this. It’s a Feature that is nice to have. But to not play the biggest game of the year becuase it lacks a feature that really affects gameplay in a minor way is just retarded.

We need less whiney gamers and more that learn to just deal with what we are given.

I also do not believe that the big reason for this lack of dedicated servers is piracy. I believe it’s more of the industry wanting to build a community. A community that has been FAILING for years now on the PC. As much as dedicated servers is NICE, the #1 complaint from just about every gamer I know is the lack of community. The PC community is Segmented and consists of groups of people that don’t like playing with new people and look down on their noses to people that don’t Regularly see on “Their” servers. This matchmaking service address this for the MAJORITY of gamers. Yes there are die-hard cry babies, but you REALLY have to have a solipsistic viewpoint to think a company needs to develop their product YOUR way.

Don’t like it.. don’t buy it.. but you’ll be one of the few. I would bet my left nut that at LEAST 120k out of the 140k that signed that joke of a petition will STILL get and play the game.. but cry whine bitch and all around be a punk cry baby.

PC gamers have a sense of entitlement that needs to stop! yes I stated I play games on the PC also, but I also play 360 and ps3. You don’t like it YOU BUILD A BETTER GAME!

“We need less whiney gamers and more that learn to just deal with what we are given.”

Sorry but fuck you for even trying to say this seriously.

Are you fine with the price increase then, seeing as they are charging more and actively removing something it would irritate me somewhat.

Im pirating this. I feel completely at ease with that.

Oh and for those of you that are console side and have trouble trying to work out what the problem is just read this : http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=225744&site=pcg

Millions and Millions of people have played just fine for years on consoles without dedicated servers. PC gamers just feel like they are entitled to things, like it’s their natural born right to have a dedicated server. Sure it kinda sucks, but you deal with it or don’t play… and the rest of everyone else will enjoy the game. Guess what, wake up call, it’s the of the future for the majority of PC games. So get used to it. Or go find another hobby or better yet build your own game.

Ok so speculating time here, what if IW removed voice coms from MW2, stating that it took up too much bandwith or could exploit children or something.

They then acted like complete asses when questioned about the removal of all voice coms from the game.

Its not something big is it? Would you just go along with that then? Even pay more money for it? Pay more for a lesser product?

I think its also worth mentioning that one of the most popular multiplayer games of all time is based around Dedicated servers and without those it would have never ever taken off.

Mushroom, ever hear of supply and demand?

It’s how consumers get what they want or need.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with saying “this is what I want in a product, supply it or I’ll go elsewhere” If you’re going to meekly “take what you’re given” then you’ve got to be prepared for that to be a big thick dick in your ass whether you like it or not.

Me, I’m not the sort to get bum fucked.

Yes… I would still get it, but I would be irritated by it. (loss of voice). but I would still be playing it. Boycotting a game for any reason to me is stupid. noone in the industry gives a crap about these petitions. So it’s more just for the community to get an artificial sense of being heard.

In this case though, it really is the way future non-mmo PC gaming is headed. There is no money to be made by dedicated servers because it won’t effect sales. But there is plenty of money being spent on the upkeep of these servers.

Lastly, just because something has worked in the does not mean it will continue in the future. Follow the money my friend.. follow the money. Love it or Hate it… money determines everything… and dedicated servers cost more money to run than money they lose in sales from the uber extremist gamer who tries to make a point.

Freedom – I dont’ have energy to fight losing battles. Also I wouldnt’ call it getting “fucked”. That’s pretty harsh term for something that only costs $60. There is nothing wrong with voicing opinions. BOYCOTTING a game because a lack of a feature is just retarded. If IW comes out with some Uber patch that allows Dedicated servers I will come back here and virtually kiss your ass.

Ok now I know you have no idea what you are talking about.

Ok so all those TF2 Multiplay servers paid for by the players and have no real impact on the publisher make no money? At all?

News to me there Tex.

“noone in the industry gives a crap about these petitions.”

Valve and flying the L4D2 boycott leaders out to Seattle to check out the game.
Dice have also confirmed solidly that both 1943 and Bad Company 2 will have full dedicated Server support on the PC.

So its pretty much just dick companies like Activision that don’t give a fucking shit about what you think. Actual developers care a hell of alot what the people playing their games think.

HOLY CRAP MAN.. can you please reference a game made in the last decade!.. yeah.. they flew him out there as a PR stunt.. and what did it change .. NOTHING but the gamers mind. And Dice didn’t PUT dedicated servers in because of a petition, they again merely took the opportunity of bad press against MW2 to capitalize on a feature they already had. I am not saying every game from Today date forward will be not have Dedicated … but it will be phased out.

TF2 did not make the blockbuster splash financially… It was carried by the Mod Community and had more creaper sales. MW2 will make more sales in November than TF2 did in whole

“BOYCOTTING a game because a lack of a feature is just retarded”

Not buying something because it doesn’t do what you want it to is retarded?

Ok then.

ah ha ha keep grabbing. Last decade indeed.

The latest Wolfenstein has dedicated servers if you want something really new.

That never sold massive amounts though so lets discount that aswell shall we.

No… you just mentioned 2 different things.. Boycotting and Buying.. I’m fine with you voicing your opinion by not buying. But to ORGANIZE a lockout (boycott) is retarded.

ROFL.. and how many people bought wolf? nuff said there. Like it our not.. companies will be using the non dedicated model. Especially ones that answer to stockholders

There are still dedicated servers available for Kingpin. Its a fact that player funded dedicated servers help keep a game more populated and fun filled than matchmaking can ever ever hope to achieve.

Battlefield Heroes has over 2 million users and oh look dedicated server there aswell. Lets not forget that DICE answer to EA. You seem to be pointlessly hung up on actual playing figures so lets trot out Counter Strike again.

Stockholders eh?

“I’m fine with you voicing your opinion by not buying.” = a boycott.

A single person boycott is fine aslong as you don’t tell anyone else about it, then it becomes retarded hurr durr.

Ugh, you’re like a borken record talking about games that dont’ really matter in today’s landscape. yes they were good in thy day.. but the industry has evolved. You seem to be stuck on a small niche of people instead of what the vast majority of gamers play.The number of console gamers embarrass the PC numbers (unless you include solitaire and mine sweeper). The pc gamers complaining are such a small part of the picture.. but damn they sure cry loud. Cry as loud as you want … but you aren’t going to change things. It is what it is, you can buy it or not. I choose to enjoy a great game and let a minor thing like Dedicated servers go by the way side… would i prefer them, sure.. but not at the expense of boycotting a game.

De-fucking-volved more like.

The vast majority? Like over 9 million people playing on dedicated servers everyday? You mean like that?

The number of Wii owners dwarfs that of every other console available. So why not just concentrate all power on trying to crack the playerbase into buying games?

Apparently we play games for fun.

Becuase the Wii sold because of exercise and party games, not because of games the gamer community really plays. Those 9 mill still are the minority compared to the PS3/360 online gaming community. There is NO REAL community on PC games. I applaud them for building this service. I would prefer they allow dedicated registered servers though. I am all for building community. Sadly, unlike consoles, PC users build their own. Hey that’s great! I LOVE that option. However, I as a born-again PC gamer, I like the community, this service provides. I am appreciative of this feature. Why can’t people have their own but be required for that server to be registered thru their service. Still provides community and matchmaking. Matchmaking that in my experience is pretty damn good. I play about 4-5 days per week. From my experience with being a dailly gamer, f0r 31 years… I rarely ever have kids playing in any of my games. I am actually matched well with other gamers like myself. I rarely ever have abusive players as a whole.

I welcome a better, more “joined”, community on the PC. Instead, I find fragmented elitism. “Real World” practice have shown me, I find compatible gamers on MS Live with no effort to look for them. This of course, is purely from my viewpoint.

Mushroom, I’m surprised to say the least. Why should it be ok with anyone that they’re losing features they normally payed for in the past? Its not as if any of the people who have a problem with this are getting anything for free. Yes, its the most anticipated game this year and it may be popular, but it isn’t above scrutiny; You seem to be caught up in the hype more than most members here.

Maybe there is some “larger picture”, i’m not getting. I see this as an expense to a company and thus needs to be controlled. I see revenue all over this. It’s probably because I don’t see the community on the PC. If people are making money from my game. They need to pay up. I know there is money made in dedicated gaming servers (private & public). SO as a gaming a company, I would like to maximize my intake. People making money off of me is not acceptable. How do I take control of something costing the company money? I establish control of the product. People have gotten a lot of things in the past for free. Doesn’t mean it should continue. It simply comes down to this. Buy my product or don’t. The numbers are worth it.

It is one thing to come under scrutiny, it’s another to spearhead a campaign (Boycott) against the livlihood of others. When you could simply speak with your wallets. Why must that scrutiny ruin it for others?

I surrender

Ok, I can agree with some of what you’re saying, but this is ActiBlizz, not a struggling 3rd party developer; They didn’t need to do it because it was taking away from profits, just that they weren’t gaining any. I think the fact that you are arguing in favor of a large and stupidly profitable company taking options away from gamers, just to make money on top of the piles upon piles that they are already making, shows the disconnect between what you believe is best for your favorite developer and when the developer is doing well by the community. That particular job doesn’t end once the ‘Make a good game’ objective is complete.

The PC version of Call of Duty 4 was *severely* ravaged by piracy and sold poorly on it (Infinity Ward have said so themselves), yet the game still sold over 13 million copies since then.

PC owners were a blip on the radar of Call of Duty 4′s sales, and the user-base on both next gen consoles has increased by about 25% since Call of Duty 4 came out. This game could *easily* penetrate the 14 million mark within a year.

“Im pirating this. I feel completely at ease with that.”

The irony and stupidity of criticising the game for something you consider a *huge* issue and then playing the game is not lost on me. The “problem” with the game is still going to exist when you buy it.

You’re gonna prove your point by playing it anyway? Wow, way to prove your complaints with this game are serious and important to you!

mushroom stamp is obviously a console fanboi and troll. go away this is grown up talk nobody wants to listen to your temper tantrums anymore just because you cant have an intellectual argument without making the most asinine and ignorant posts ive ever seen on this site.

“mushroom stamp is obviously a console fanboi and troll. go away this is grown up talk nobody wants to listen to your temper tantrums anymore just because you cant have an intellectual argument without making the most asinine and ignorant posts ive ever seen on this site.”

He’s the one posting well developed, well thought out arguments that aren’t based purely on his own personal tastes or overbearing sense of false entitlement, while you bitch and moan “ME! ME! ME!” about what you feel *you* deserve…and you have to audacity to call *him* the fanboy?

There’s nothing funnier to watch than a petulant child telling an adult to grow up…

Call of Duty 4 was, as already pointed out, pirated to all hell and back on the PC and made up a fairly small slab of the game’s sales.

They have *every* right to design the game in the way they choose, seeing how the so called “fans” already proved their respect for the franchise by essentially *stealing* it.

I haven’t really commented much on this issue, and I didn’t sign the petition, even though I can see how PC gamers are taking IW’s banning of dedicated servers as an attack on them.

My more ‘instinctive’ response is to side with the gamers, because we mostly all have similar interests in what we want from gaming.

Dedicated servers might not seem much to people who don’t use them, and see no need for them, but surely that isn’t the point.

Surely the point is that this is something that almost all PC FPS’s have, and it’s something that all PC FPS players want?

The fact that it’s being ‘withheld’ means that IW are forcing gamers to play in a way that they would normally NEVER do, and that must mean that another solution to whatever problem they’re trying to solve would be preferable.

However, I also think that there’s a slight case of snobbery on the side of the PC gamers here. Console gamers, including myself, enjoy hour after hour of amazing FPS gaming with a non-dedicated server setup, so does that mean that there’s something wrong with us?

Do we just like gaming on a worse off level than PC gamers?

I think that IW and Acti are both confident that when PC gamers actually start playing the game and seeing that things aren’t all that bad, people will forget that there was ever a problem, and I’d tend to agree with that if that’s how they do think.

So basically, I think that while stopping dedicated servers being used isn’t such a good idea, I don’t think that it’ll prove to be such a big problem in the end.

So how much has CoD 4 sold on the PC then? Really show me all the numbers for every single area that its on sale, show me Steam stats, Direct2Drive stats, everything.

You can’t. So saying “made up a fairly small slab of the game’s sales.” is something you have no idea about. No idea at all.

Im going to pirate the game play its single player and then delete it. I have better multiplayer games than CoD.

Also CoD would never ever have taken off were it not for the PC userbase getting behind the series when it very first started but don’t let that stop everyone following the money and blaming everything on pirates.

Seems to me that one thing is being over looked in all of this. Doesn’t a true match making service pool the numbers in a tighter cluster, allowing and easier time finding a game to join? Doesn’t a match making service keep goons from cheating, at least somewhat? Isn’t a match making service what has fueled LIVE and PSN for years(seems to do pretty well there).
I can tell you that the “outcry” from this issue seems to be coming from people I wouldn’t want to play with anyways. Sure, they won’t say it, but many of these people will Torrent the game, and MOD the hell out of it. Your right, not all will, but history has shown us that many of them do. Just wwhat I want to do, find and join a server that is over run with game freeks with mods/hacks that allow for them to snipe me thro solid walls, track my every movement/position, and even make themselves inviso/imortal all in the name of good fun and a laugh. Nope, been there and done that. In my mind match making and closed networking and monitered “service”(even if it is peer hosted), is a reasonable solution. And guess what? Its there game, they can do what they want to with it, your just buying the rights/liscence to play it.

As far as boycot, yea its a little extreme. To go around and organize hundreds of thousands of people into signing an online petition? Dumb. There is no gaurentte that said people will even buy the PC retail version to begin with. I wouldn’t sign it, if I buy this game it will on a console. But I have read a lot of signers that said they signed it, but are buying PS3. What sense does that make? that isn’t a msg to Acti, thats a website trying to get hits/visits and make a splash for themself. Don’t like what the game has to offer? Don’t buy it. Simple. Stop the flag waving and banner carrying, it just makes you look foolish.

Last thought, get the hell off of DICE for giving you exacxtly what your pissed IW isn’t. DICE will have dedicated servers, they have heard that people want them. So they have made it known they will have them. How can you get pissed at that? Because DICEs game doesn’t have the words Call Of Duty? Again Dumb. Esp when you consider that Battlefield and CoD are basicly the same intended audiance. Want a new fps squad based shooter with Dservers? Hello Bad Company 2.

@G1GA

“However, I also think that there’s a slight case of snobbery on the side of the PC gamers here. Console gamers, including myself, enjoy hour after hour of amazing FPS gaming with a non-dedicated server setup, so does that mean that there’s something wrong with us?

Do we just like gaming on a worse off level than PC gamers?”

That is it in a nut shell. A lot of PC gamers have BHD Syndrome. They play of Too Expensive Rigs, and often feel better then their console brethern. Eleitism at its very core. I used to game on PC, but I got tired of upgrading to run something new. So, for what I needed to spend on video card, I went and bought a new Xboxone(yrs ago), got Mechassult, jumped online and never looked back. Now I even rent the dam things, meaning that I play more and pay less and never have to worry if my PC is rated high enough anymore.

“You can’t. So saying “made up a fairly small slab of the game’s sales.” is something you have no idea about. No idea at all.”

It takes five minutes of Googling to find this information. If you’re too lazy to look… not my problem.

Actually its the complete opposite in terms of speed in joining a game.

Compare joining a TF2 server to starting a game of Halo 3, the Halo matchmaking service takes a fucking age joining you up with other people, some of the time it fails on its arse aswell. CoD4 was pretty well hacked on the consoles aswell, even more so than the PC version, wallhacks, glitches and exploits can be easily dealth with on a server with a ban or through a simple VAC or Puinkbuster update. Those faults were allowed to fester on the PS3 version for quite sometime before a patch was released.

Also I can’t believe MOD are being looked apon as something bad.

I guess I am a relic if this is actually what the modern gamer actually thinks. Jesus its depressing.

Valve don’t release Steam sales figures, the same goes for D2D. You have no idea how many games were sold through there. Google all you like.

“Valve don’t release Steam sales figures, the same goes for D2D. You have no idea how many games were sold through there.”

Who said anything about Valve or Steam?

I Played CoD WaW(xb360) this weekend, Seemed pretty damn good to me. No one was hacking/moding anything. The games went from Map to Map pretty smoothly and fun was had by all.

@pracer
There is your problem see – having fun is beside the point. The point is that when a game doesn’t have some features you want playing another game is out of the question and perpetuating the given reason for removal of aforementioned feature is the best course of action.

I don’t know if PC sales of CoD MW2 tank and PC sales of B BC2 do well … seems like that is sending the msg the only way that folks wearing the suits will understand.

I just don’t really understand how playing another game instead of the one you thought was missing features is a bad thing.

hur durr giving reasonable explanations for disliking a specific decision is stupid you are stupid I will show this by making you out to be a hunched over evil thing from the pits of hell rather than a normal person thats a bit pissed off with being asked to pay more for a lesser product.

herp a durr hurr.

Oh and I mentioned Steam and D2D because they constitute a large slice of PC game sales, the exact numbers however are never released because Valve keep them to themselves.

Oh and its not a problem at all, I will be buying Bad Company 2 and 1943, I also wanted to buy and enjoy Modern Warfare 2, just like I did with every other CoD. Im not though, actually I might not even waste the bandwith d-loading it.

Good.

No-one cares what you do absolutezeroIQ.

Don’t play the game, don’t buy, don’t download it.

And while you’re at it, why don’t you do us all a favour and stop whinging about it like a little girl.

“a normal person thats a bit pissed off with being asked to pay more for a lesser product.”

So a normal person in this situation steals what they wanted rather than paying for it? If you are going to get something out of the game worth the money being asked then pay and enjoy, if not just go and buy/play something else.

@ MushroomStamp : Dedicated servers won’t disapear because multiplayer online games are outright unplayable without them. I recently reviewed Operation Flashpoint : Dragon Rising. They don’t have dedicated servers and the multiplayer is outright unplayable. It’s a major flaw for a PC game to come without dedicated servers. If games want bad reviews and poor sales, they can continue this way.

and MOD the hell out of it.
What is your problem with mods ?

Isn’t a match making service what has fueled LIVE and PSN for years(seems to do pretty well there)
Aren’t dedicated servers what has fueled online gaming since the very beginning ?

And you seem to be confused. Matchmaking and anticheat features are two different things. One has nothing to do with the other. All PC FPS currently use anticheat features.

Call of Duty 4 was, as already pointed out, pirated to all hell and back on the PC and made up a fairly small slab of the game’s sales.
Do you have actual figures or are you just repeating what Activision marketing departement made IW say a year ago ?

As for the issue of dedicated servers, it isn’t all that bad, because apparently, IW.NET will use dedicated servers. The problem is that there will be apparently no custom maps, and they will sell map packs (Something that is unnacceptable).